Meguiars products are too pricey!!(in Europe)

[Mike Phillips]

I feel like I'm between a rock and a hard place. I'm responsible for what takes place on this forum and in some cases, what doesn't.

Feedback like this is important, but please keep it civil, please keep it professional with the appropriate language. Bad language is only going to act to diminish your viewpoint.

It's the holidays here in the U.S., so let's all practice some temperance and moderation in this thread as most people have pushed away from the keyboard to spend time with family and friends, including yours truly.

While the topic of this thread is important, and slightly charged with emotion... please, please, please, try to make your points in a positive and constructive manner. In doing so, your feedback, comments and suggestions will carry more weight.

Thank you,

[oldsalt]

Here is my reply from Meguiars Australia.

I don't accept much of it as being truthful, that's accepting the bit about they have a higher profit margin than the US.

Thank you for your enquiry.
Firstly, we are a 100% Australian owned company, with import and distribution rights to Meguiars, as well as other brands.
There are a number of reasons that our pricing is higher in Australia. (It is also worth looking at other countries such as the UK, NZ, etc etc that effectively have the same structure, and similar buy prices to ourselves.)
1) Our buy price from Meguiars Inc..
2) As an importer, we are effectively an additional link in the distribution chain as compared to the US.
3) Freight, importation charges etc.
4) Exchange rate fluctuation risk
5) In relative terms (per $ sales) our advertising and marketing spend is far greater.
6) The retail margin in Australia may be greater.
7) We actively participate in, and support many initiatives to assist and grow the car enthusiast community. These need to be funded.

In the example you give, we do not sell the W-9006 in Australia. We sell the W-9000 8inch pad which retails around $30.00.

I trust this gives some insight into the difference. Whilst I agree that $40 is a lot of money for a wax, in the case of Nxt Gen Tech Wax, you will get a minimum of 10 and maximum of 18 full waxes per bottle. This equates to around $3.00 per full car application. In our view this is the best car wax on the market, and still very good value at this price.

Neil, thanks once again for your interest.

Regards

Andrew Spira
6) The retail margin in Australia may be greater.W-9006 = unavailable in Australia, WHY, this is a basic product. 5) In relative terms (per $ sales) our advertising and marketing spend is far greater = I have never seen an advertisment anywhere for the product

[SteveT]

Same kind of answer Megs Canada gives. I don't buy it. I will address each point in the answer by number.


1) What price does Megs USA sell to these people? For sake of comparison what price does Megs sell NXT Wax to Autozone in the USA and what price is Megs selling NXT Wax to Megs Australia for? If Megs USA is selling to Megs Australia for the same price as they sell to Autozone than Megs Australia is ripping people off. If Megs USA is selling to Megs Australia at a much higher price than they sell to Autozone or Napa or whoever than the problem is with Megs USA.

3) This one kills me. If freight and importation charges are so high and thats why they jack up prices why is it that an Australian citizen can order from Autogeek or CMA and get the products cheaper than if they purchased in Australia.They used to be able to order from Megs USA at one time I believe but Megs USA put a stop to that. I know in Canada I can order from the US cheaper than it costs to buy here. Wouldn't I have to pay the same charges as an importer? Truth is they pay less if any compared to an individual.

4) Exchange rate fluctuation is legit. But it doesn't justify a product costing 3 times the price that it does in the USA. Unless of coures the US dollar is worth 3 times more than the AUS dollar. We all know it isn't.


5) I don't buy this one. There is almost no advertsing of Megs in Canada and by the sounds of it there isn't much in Australia either. Nice try though.
On the other hand Megs is all over the place in the USA but thats where the prices are cheapest.

6) What exactly does this mean? Does it mean that they make more per sale? Well no kidding. At the prices they are charging they should be


7) This one kills me too. Megs USA participates in the same things x 10 so why no huge price mark ups in the USA?


I would really like to know what Megs USA is charging these other countrys when they sell to them?

[Kool_zx3]

Great reply stevet b/c it seems all a little fishy to me

[Mike Phillips]

Originally posted by stevet
I would really like to know what Megs USA is charging these other countries when they sell to them?

Do you know of any other companies that will tell you this kind of information? Any?

Do you know of any other companies with such an open forum for people to come complain on?

Do you want me to close this thread and move it to the Moderators forum?

The tone is getting nasty, and with a in your face, type of attitude. It's not going to help anyone if it continues in this manner and nobody likes to be talked to, (or posted to), in this manner.

[SteveT]

Originally posted by Mike Phillips
Do you know of any other companies that will tell you this kind of information? Any?

I felt it was a legit question. We have an answer from an importer and they are saying one of the reasons they charge so much is because of what Megs USA charges them. If thats true everybody who is complaining about their local Megs is complaining about the wrong thing. If Megs Australia is getting charged very high prices it would explain why they charge the prices they do. Same for Canada and Asia etc.


No Mike I don't know of another company that will give that info out. But they are not charging the same prices as Megs either and thats what people are complaining about.

[Mike Phillips]

Originally posted by stevet
I felt it was a legit question. We have an answer from an importer and they are saying one of the reasons they charge so much is because of what Megs USA charges them. If thats true everybody who is complaining about their local Megs is complaining about the wrong thing. If Megs Australia is getting charged very high prices it would explain why they charge the prices they do. Same for Canada and Asia etc.


No Mike I don't know of another company that will give that info out. But they are not charging the same prices as Megs either and thats what people are complaining about.

You know in the beginning of this thread, I stated that I don't know very much about distribution and marketing... nothing has changed since I posted that.

If you want to know how to use ScratchX, or how long to wait till you wipe off ColorX, then I can answer those questions. As for all of the other questions in this thread, I don't have answers, but I have shared the link with others at Meguiar's.

At the time I'm writing this, it's Sunday evening, tomorrow is a National Holiday, nobody is in the office as everyone is doing what I would like to do and that is to take some time off to relax and spend time with my family.

I'm not going to remove this thread, but I am going to close it till Tuesday, if you want to add anything to what's already been said, type it up in Notepad and save it till Tuesday. Any threads started to bypass the closing of this thread will be deleted and the forum member will lose posting privileges at least temporarily.
(Edit: This happened to oldsalt I'm sorry to say, but as of 6/2/05 membership and posting privileges have been restored)

My son is 6 years old and he wants daddy to help him build a fort, so being that it's Sunday, a day of rest for many people, including myself, I don't want to continue babysitting this thread for the rest of the night and all day tomorrow. Consider this thread closed till Tuesday, May 31st.

Thank you everyone for your feedback.

Please enjoy the rest of your Sunday evening and if you and/or your employer recognizes Memorial Day as a holiday, then please enjoy tomorrow also.

Mike Phillips

[Mike Phillips]

This thread is now open again, below I have included a statement to explain and clarify some of the reasons for differences in pricing. Please be mindful of all forum rules when replying to this thread.

Forum Rules


Meguiar's International Pricing Statement


The Meguiar’s brand was founded on developing and providing surface care products that demonstrably exceed the performance expectations of enthusiasts. As Meguiar’s has expanded globally, questions about differences in prices from one country to another occasionally are raised.

Cross-border price differences are not unique to the Meguiar’s brand, or surface care products, but are experienced in virtually every product category. From wax to running shoes to fast food hamburgers, wide ranges of pricing for similar products are the global norm. These price differences are a direct consequence of vastly different cost structures. When the costs of transport, import duties, local VAT, labeling for local language and health and safety requirements are all added in, the cost difference can be substantial. And although it is true that international taxes can sometimes be evaded for purchases made online, this is a practice that is not legal and certainly a practice that Meguiar’s could never condone.

In addition to the additional logistical and governmental costs noted, Meguiar’s has also established a local subsidiary or distribution partner for most countries around the world. This local organization provides tremendous value in organizing in-country distribution, conducting detailing seminars, providing customer service and answering technical queries from enthusiasts every day, establishing advertising and communication programs, and many, many other key services in building the business. Each of these local partners has a real passion for the car hobby, and also has a real cost of these services, and yes, they also need to make a profit. Without their efforts and local investment, Meguiar’s products would still be largely unavailable to the majority of global car enthusiasts.

Rather than comparing pricing from one country to another, we believe a much more relevant and fairer comparison is to make a local price comparison with products of comparable quality and performance. We and our partners strive to price our products competitive, and are committed to provide products that exceed the enthusiast’s performance expectations.

We do sincerely thank you for your passion in bringing your concern to our attention. We also hope that our explanation helps you in understanding some of the complexity of the global marketplace and the many factors that go into determining the price of Meguiar’s products in your country.


*End of statement

~~~~~~~~~~~


Please try to remember that the primary purpose of this forum is to help people to better use our products to get the results they're looking for. We do appreciate both negative and positive feedback as this helps us to continue doing what we're doing that is right, and improve where we need correction.

Thank you...

Your Meguiar's Online Team

[dmoore]

I've been reading the posts on this topic and agree that some of the retail prices of megs products here are expensive. I live in Nova Scotia, Canada and recently went to my auto supply store to price a W8006 polishing pad. The retail price is $30.32 but they would sell it to me for $25.00. The W64DA backing plate retailed for $41.00 but they would sell one for $35.00. That's $97.75 for two pads and the backing plate with the 15% sales tax here.(That's another rip off!).

I ended up calling megs and ordered their kit which consisted of two polishing pads, a finishing pad and the backing plate for $32.95 US. With shipping it came to $48.45 and after exchange was $62.73 Can. When the parcel arrived, there was a broker fee and tax to pay in the amount of $37.38. All total , it cost me $100.11. I basically got the finishing pad for free.

By no means do I think this is cheap. It's still three times what our neighbors are paying. But some of the other products aren't as expensive here. When I was at the auto supply store to price the pads, I ordered a 32 oz bottle of #83 and the same size bottle of #80. When I returned to buy them I explained to them that some people on this forum were wondering where the price increases were coming from, the manufacturer, the distributer, or the dealer. He explained that some of megs items were marked up alot more than others. He told me his cost on the W8006 was $17.33. When you look at the retail price of 30.32, that's a 75 %increase! Wow!!

On the other hand, the price I paid for the #83 was $19.63. The US price is $18.99 and with exchange would be $24.69 so it was actually cheaper. The #80 was $16.49. The US price is $14.99 and with exchange $19.49 so this to was actually cheaper than the US. He said there wasn't much mark up on these products ( plus he gave me a good discount.) Not sure what the retail is on these.

So I guess we'll have to take the good with the bad. I'm just going to buy megs where I can get them the cheapest. This is just my experience with buying megs products.

I would like to thank Meguiars for making this forum available to enthusiasts such as myself. There is a wealth of information here for people to read and be able to expand their skills. And a big thumbs up to you Mike for your professionalism and sharing your vast knowledge of your detailing techniques. For this we all owe you. Keep up the good work!!!

[mheaford]

Mike, I appreciate the response on this.

I've made me feelings known before but I would state the following based on the official response:

Rather than comparing pricing from one country to another, we believe a much more relevant and fairer comparison is to make a local price comparison with products of comparable quality and performance. We and our partners strive to price our products competitive, and are committed to provide products that exceed the enthusiast’s performance expectations.

It's hard to judge what products Meguiars is aiming against. For example in the US 64oz (1891ml) of NXT wash is $6.99, it appears that this is cheaper than Turtlewax car wash which seemed to be around $7.99. In the UK 64oz of NXT car wash is £12.99 but 2.5 litres of Turtlewax car wash is £7.99. So as you can see you can 1.5 times as much Turtlewax as NXT for almost half the price.

I'm assumming Meguiars is aiming it's consumer line of products at Joe Public and not the real enthuiast (who probably uses products from the pro range). If some average guy walks into Halfords (a auto parts store in the UK) and sees the Meguiars products at twice the price of other products then they are not even going to think about buying Meguiars as a) it's way more expensive than what they are currently using and b) They've probably never heard of it. It's these customers Meguiars should be going after, if the products were more competively priced against other consumer lines then maybe they would give it a try and they would find out how good it is, tell their friends etc and Meguiars would have more sales. This to me adds up to lost opportunites (and sales) from the average consumer.

The enthusiast on the other hand probably uses a lot of pro products, and due to reading up a lot probably orders a large number of their supplies from overseas to save money. I read a lot of car care and general car forums and in the past couple of weeks I know there have been group buys from Pakshak (over $1000 worth!), Autopia and Excel Detail. This again screams at me that these are all potential Meguiars UK sales that have slipped away due to pricing.

As mentioned earlier in the thread i would be interesting to know the profit margin on these products as I will share the following experience. I have a supplier of Meguiars products here in the UK that gives me a 10% and ships for free, I recently bought the new NXT glass cleaner for £7.19 after discount, when it turned up there was around £4 of postage on the box. This means I really paid around £3 for the actual product. Either this guy is losing money hand over fist or he is at least breaking even selling at that price!

In the UK we are used to higher prices than the UK (thanks to a 17.5% sales tax) but I have never known a product here to sell for about 300% more here than in the US which is what things like Ultimate Wipes, Ultimate Bonnets & NXT wash do.

I hope you don't take all this as a rant as I'm trying to be constructive, I have only been into detailing for a few months and started off only using Meguiars products but recently I bought a load of microfibres and a new wash mitt that weren't Meguiars purely due to the uncompetitive price. I want to continue to use Meguiars products and see the Meguiars brand really increase over here in the UK. My worry is that the average consumer will ignore Meguiars because of the price and the enthuisast will either source the products overseas or move to another companies products again because of price. This could potentially leave Meguiars with a decision as to whether to continue in the UK or pull out. I'm sure everyone would agree with me that all us loyal users want is to be able to source Meguiars locally at competitive prices.

I actually think it's great that people get this worked up about your products and want to continue to use them rather than move to the cheaper products!

[SteveT]

It seems the more I read and hear about Megs international pricing the more convinced I am that Megs USA is the problem. More specifically what Megs USA charges Megs Canada, Megs UK , etc. We have a response from Megs Australia and the first point in that response to why Megs Australia charges so much is because of what Megs USA charges them. In the post by dmoore he explained that some Megs products are very reasonable in Canada and that is (according to the sales person at the shop) because some Megs products are not marked up as much as others. I have pointed this out in several posts. I can buy Megs NXT Metal Polish for about $7.00 CDN and that is very comparable to the USA pricing. Other Megs products are just way out there at almost 3 x the price of the USA. Than we get a response from Megs themselves that reopened this thread and it was the routine answer I get from Megs Canada about shipping, and set up costs etc. It would seem to me the costs as a percentage of price would be the same for all Megs products so how do you explain the huge price swings from one Megs product to another?

To respond to the Megs response posted by Mike (thanks Mike) I will use the same arguments I used in my post about Megs Australia's response.
But I would like to comment on the request that we compare Megs prices to comparable products. Being 40 mins from the USA border allows me to see this in a different light than most international Megs users. I can cross the border and see Megs NXT Paste Wax for $16.00 USD and then see it on my local Canadian Tire shelf for $37.00 CDN. At the same time a comparable Mothers Product will sell for only a few dollars more in Canada than it does in the USA. This goes for 3M, Eagle one, Turtle Wax, Mothers, and more. It becomes very clear Megs adds an huge price premium in excess of what shipping, currency exchange, and all the other reasons they give would justify. It's done because people will pay it and it will stop when people refuse to pay it.

[oldsalt]

I don't find Meguiars official response creditable at all.

RE: "This local organization provides tremendous value in organizing in-country distribution, conducting detailing seminars, providing customer service and answering technical queries from enthusiasts every day, establishing advertising and communication programs, and many, many other key services in building the business. "

I have never heard of a detailing seminar in Australia, customer service is part and parcel of any company, advertising here in Australia is minimal, communication programs is a mystery to me.

The Australian distributor was at least honest, they admitted their margin was higher. Meguiars "partner" in Australia also distribute other companies products which if they are car care products would be a conflict of interest I would think?

Whilst Meguiars may not agree about buying online, some countries like Australia do not have several of the Meguiar range available to them. This forum is terrific in giving advice, but what is the good of it if the product is not available in a particular country. So, from my perspective, Meguiars are condoning the importing of product.

I agree that Meguiars US appear to be the problem in that they have no control on their "partners" regarding stocking of products, pricing, advertising, services to the motoring community other than car shows and race meetings.

Regardless, I am only trying to be constructive as I would love to see reasonably priced product with the full range available in Australia. I tell people here that I use meguiars and they haven't a clue what I'm talking about.

[SteveT]

As far as I'm concerned no company is worth going through this garbage. Megs is going to continue charging what they can get away with. I am going to continue not to pay the prices. The complaining we are doing on this forum is not going to do a thing if people continue to pay the prices. Megs can give all the reasons they want for charging the prices they do but the #1 reason is that people continue to pay. If people stopped paying this problem would go away over night. Either it would or Megs would. There are far too many lower priced products just as good and better in some cases as Megs so there is no excuse for me to pay the prices Megs charges in Canada.

Normally I wouldn't waste my energy asking for explanations from companies about why they charge rip off prices. I normally thumb my nose at them and buy the lower priced better quality product and laugh at the people who pay the crazy prices. I gave Megs the benefit of the doubt and actually thought some one would give me a good reason for the prices. Instead we get these scripted responses spit back at us and Megs thinks we are stupid enough to accept that. Well I'm not. I'm done with it. No company is worth the aggravation. I won't pay the prices for the marked up products and I will stop using ALL Megs products effective immediately. Even though it is easy for me to get Megs products cheaply by going over the border I will no longer do this. I won't support companies that rip off hard working people.

[Tim Lingor]

SteveT,

Mike and I have both made it very clear that this in your face tone was non-constructive to the MOL community, and will NOT be tolerated.

As I said, we try very hard to provide assistance to those that need help with choosing the right product to give the best results possible. Moreover, constructive criticism is only going to make a product better in the long run.

However, MOL is not your personal sounding board. There are appropriate channels to place your complaint. Just because the reply made by Meguiar's does not suit your needs, does not make it any less valid.

This thread has gone on long enough! If Mike or management wish to re-open it, that is is their right. But right now, this thread is closed!

Tim