Buying a coin-op

[Five Star]

Originally posted by buda
Keep in mind that self service carwash customers are "do-it-yourself" customers. Do you think that a do it yourself customer would pay to have his/her car detailed? They will not even pay $5.00 to get their car washed at an automatic wash.

The jury is out on whether a self service car wash is a good venue for a detail business. Some offer detailing but I have no information on how well they do.

Also, a three bay self serve in a small town is not going to pay you much money in return. Maybe $700 per bay per month which is $2100 gross and a net of 50% or $1050 per month.

So hopefully you can make the payments on land and business and cover all operating expenses from the other $1050.

Regards

Bud Abraham

did you have a bad experience with a coin op? you seem to be highly negative.

although you do raise valid concerns in regards to people washing their own cars and revenue, but look at how many people come to this forum who read how automatic car washes instill swirls in the paint but dont have the experience to remove them, so they will have it done professionally and hand wash it themselves.

remember an effectively marketed product reaching a targeted customer will always sell.

if you dont believe me just watch a few infomercials.

people in business are only limited by their mind

[buda]

Not at all negative, just being realistic. I have been in the car wash business for nearly 40 years and know what it takes to build and operate a car wash and the information provided here is accurate.

As for car washes scratching cars, it was proven in a test conducted by the Technological University of Munich for Mercedes Benz that hand washing a car puts more scratches and causes more damage than washing in an automatic carwash.

The conclusion they reached was that because the automatic bombards the paint with water and shampoo as the car is being washed it forms a protective barrier between the wash material and the paint. Whereas in hand washing as soon as you put the mitt or sponge on the car the first time you impregnate the washing device with grit and continuing to use this is like rubbing a piece of sandpaper over the car.

Microscopic photos taken of both paint finishes varifies this conclusion.

Regards
Bud Abraham

[SeabreezeDetailing]

Here is a copy of the studies done.

http://www.marlinscarwash.com/SUB/TexasCarWashStudy.pdf

To each his own.

[gb387]

Originally posted by SeabreezeDetailing
To each his own.

I have never seen that article... Sure the uniformed person washing their car with the "sponge" or a "water spray brush" and not properly pre-rinsing is going to add scratches to their paint. Now.... If you wash your vehicle properly, the way it should be done the scratches will be much less than an automatic wash. There is a guy where I work with a Benz E500... he goes only to the automatic wash(he has some type of "membership", pays once a year or something), and the paint looks like its 20 years old on a 2 year old car.

Here is how it really works, you go to the car wash the guys rinse the vehicle, run it through the wash (the dirty salt/sand/dirt covered "brushes" drag all over your car, your car passes through an air dryer, then they hand dry it with the towel they just picked up off the ground. Not to mention the car wash didn't completely clean the vehicle that the guys are now drying with dirt still on the surface. I would put my truck up against a machine washed vehicle any day. Thats how it works in the car washes I have been to. Just my opinion.

There are plenty of people out there willing to take their vehicles to the automatic/coin-op car wash and that is fine. I would guess car washes are pretty good business, judging by how many there are in my area, they never go out of business they just build more!

[buda]

Iowa:

I own a carwash as do m any of my friends and that is not how we wash cars. What car wash do you go to that washes like that?

We pressure wash off all the heavy dirt and grime and then coat the entire car with a heavy shampoo foam before a cloth and or foam brush hits the car. As well the soft cloth and foam materials are bombarded with gallons of water forming a protective barrier between the material and the paint.

I have yet to see any detailer in any shop I have ever been in use a new clean mitt when they wash a car; they dip in the bucket once and then move the dirty mitt all over the car thinking the soap suds are cleaning the car.

This is the typical way a car is hand washed in most detail shops and it is the same reason the studies concluded that hand washing scratches the car.

You might be the exception. Do you use a clean mitt for every car in one hand and a hose in another to form the barrier? If you do not then you will scratch the paint over time as the study concludes.

My friend has a 5 year old Audi S-8 that he washes at least once per day in his washes and it has never been waxed and it looks as good as the day he bought it.

I had a black Expedition that I washed everyday and it did not have any scratches in it.

So who is right? You or those millions of peole that use automatic carwashes everyday.

Regards
BudAbraham

[gb387]

I guess there are many different opinions and experiences out there. That is mine and that is yours.

[buda]

With all due respect and not in any way attempting to sound "haughty" mine is not opinion but fact. After 40 years in the carwash business and seeing it grow and flourish in these 40 years it seems that if what you stated was "fact" it would have perished as an industry long ago instead of flourishing and being one of the fast growing industries in the country, and the world for that matter.

Do you realize that professional carwashes wash over 2 billion cars a year just in the USA.

If what you say is true why do all the major auto manufacturers, including Mercedes Benz and BMW have automatic car washes in their manufacturing plants. Why do a huge number of these dealerships have automatic carwashes in their dealerships?

And, the auto manufacturers approve the use of automatic car washes by their dealers and provide them lo interest financing if they buy automatic carwashes.

You might have an opinion, but I think the "facts" indicate that your opinion is flawed.

Just a few well intentioned thoughts.

Regards
Bud Abraham

[gb387]

Sorry if it sounded like "facts"... In the second pharagraph I did say "Just my opinion. " I realize its big business I mentioned that in my last pharagraph and my opinion is not going to hurt it.

[Pete-FWA]

Originally posted by buda
Why do a huge number of these dealerships have automatic carwashes in their dealerships?

Convenience, consistency, and profitability

Dealerships want their inventory clean and it's far easier to "run one through the wash" than to find the time in an employee's schedule to hand wash a volume of vehicles.

Virtually every vehicle washed by machine comes out with the same results.

Another view from the sales aspect is value added service when customers return to the dealership for maintenance or repairs. Some dealerships encourage return visits for free washes. This is a way of keeping them on their lot instead of somewhere else when it's time to make another purchase in any of their departments. The car wash leaves a lasting impression, more so than many forms of advertising.

On average, any machine wash is far less expensive than one done by human hands.

Originally posted by buda
And, the auto manufacturers approve the use of automatic car washes by their dealers and provide them lo interest financing if they buy automatic carwashes.

Once again: convenience, consistency, profitability

Dealerships aren't going to hire "car washers" to do nothing but such a job when a machine can do it faster and for far less cost. Factories want their customer, the dealership, to sell more product, so they have jumped on the idea of on site washing systems. Their financing is another way the factory supports the dealerships.

Also, the average customer isn't as particular at time of delivery as many from our forum are. Dealerships and the manufacturers both believe that any damage done by machine wash is minimal and can be repaired during clean for delivery procedure at point of sale.

Many even believe that machine washing causes absolutely no damage to a vehicle. I do believe this is the point of conention within this post; however, it is not at most auto dealerships and service centers. They are concerned with the convenience, the consistent results, and the profitability generated by the automated wash.

[Pete-FWA]

Originally posted by buda
So who is right? You or those millions of peole that use automatic carwashes everyday.

Think about quality expectations, as I've just discussed in my previous post. Are all these people concerned about 100% meticulous quality?

Most of them are indeed, not.

They think about how convenient it is to "run the car through the wash." They are enticed by having no appointment scheduling, very little if any wait, and quick process times. Most are willing to pay their $5-10 and be gone in minutes instead of spending $15-30 and having spend far more time throughout the process with the other constraints attached.

These people are not so concerned about meticulous detail as they are about convenience, consistent results, and minimal financial cost. This is where the millions give us an answer, but not in the areas of side by side comparison of quality.

[showtime]

Exactly. You can't cater to the .01% of the people who are like us and expect to make a living off it.

[Pete-FWA]

http://meguiarsonline.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=10476

[sneek]

sry i asked i didnt know and still dont know but ya seems like you had a (to put it lightly) bad experience

[DogParkGuy]

Here is my suggestion based on talking to people who help other value small, privately-owned businesses. Pay one to two times the net profit plus the value of the land. Pay nothing for the improvements.

[Jose Torres]

Wow! Great topic! If I could just throw in my thoughts on the subject real quick.

First of all, It is important to realize that not everyone has the driveway or frontyard with a hose that we easily imagine when we think of a Do-It-Yourselfer working on their vehicle. We do not want to assume that because a person must utilize the resources of a car wash, that they do not care about or are unable to achieve high quality results. Maybe they live where salt is used on the roads, so spraying the wheel well areas and keeping the these contaminants off of the finish become even more important. I'll give you an example, ME!!

I live right smack on the beach and you can't go any further west or you would be in the ocean. I don't have a yard, but even if I did the sand and other contaminants that are in the air would make working on a vehicle pointless. So what do I do? Well first of all I take my own car wash soap. I use M00 Hi-Tech Wash and drop of NXT Car Wash. I use M00 because it has no suds, but is still the slickest wash that we make. I dilute the soap in a big spray bottle w/ a foaming sprayer. I use our Versa Angle Body Brush to wash the vehicle. So I'm only using their water and shaded facility. I start by rinsing the car off to remove any loose dirt, sand, etc, then I spray it down with car wash foam (section at a time), then wash it panel by panel (yes I rinse the brush off between panels lol), then rinse the finish off thouroughly. I then pull the car forward and use their shaded area to finish. I now know the owner and he's never had a problem with me using my own soap and brushes. I'm paying the same price as anyone, I actually am in and out of there faster than others, and he is not using or wasting his soaps and chemicals. One thing I do is respect the fact that it's his place of business so it's not like I'm out there telling people they are wrong and shouldn't be using this or that. Don't get me wrong, I would prefer to wash at my place, but as I mentioned, sometimes it's just not possible. Another interesting thing that I want to point out is that the owner inquired about supplying him with products that would fit his vending machines. We have single Leather Wipes, Dash Wipes, Bug & Tar Wipes, All Purpose Wipes, packets of Metal Polish, Endurance High Gloss, Tech Wax, and other stuff as well. To tell you the truth we get more inquiries from car wash owners than you would think we do. I guess the reason I have no problem with going there if I have to, and he has no problem with me washing my vehicle but only using his water is because neither of us feels cheated . At no point do I want to feel trapped into using anyone's product or service. Nor is he in the business of providing a location for someone to take as long as they want detailing a vehicle.

Finally, I would like to say one thing. When you sit back and think about it, unless you buy a home, cars are pretty much going to be the one of the biggest investments you will make. So it only makes sense to at least learn a few simple things to care for it properly. When you consider the cost of vehicles now days, investing in the best quality products, and accessories along with a little bit of time and effort is the very least you should do to take care of the most expensive thing on it, the finish.