Swirls after new paint?

[yohan4ws]

Car after paint

I got my car from the body shop yesterday ..

There's swirls and noticeable light scratches, should I be p!ssed ?

When I saw my car last saturday it looked mint .. the paint was new and glossy, had excellent depth ..

There were bumps on it, however, and they said come back in a month and they'd buff it and take those off the surface .. "noogies" I call em ..

So I picked up my car last night and there was a lot of compound residue every where ... odd buff marks on the front bumper where it angles to where the H used to be .. as well there were a couple 2" long light scratches on the hood right in the middle and there's noticeable swirls all over .. it doesnt look like new paint to me, it looks liked a used car ...

Should I give it a good wash, wait a month and wax it to see what happens.. or should I be pissed and demand they use compound or another PERMENANT (not like NXT or other temporary swirl filler) to make the paint actually look new .. ?

I've never had a car painted so would like some feedback before I harp on the shop ...

[tguil]

Take your car back to the body shop and ask them to "make it right". Point out the specific problem areas and tell them that you expect PERFECTION. Which by the way IS possible even though they will say it is not.

Saying that --- almost every time I have gone back to body shops to get Perfection (and there have been many times over the past 40 years), I have had to end up "making it" right myself.

To "make it right" yourself, you are going to need the right tools, products, patience and skill.

Good luck!

Tom

[Tim Lingor]

Hey,

I agree with Tom. I would return the car to the Body Shop and tell them that those swirls and what sound like buffer marks are unacceptable.

Please keep us posted!

Tim

[Mike Phillips]

Hi yohan4ws

Welcome to Meguiar's Online!

The link to your picture isn't working, can you upload a picture to our Gallery and then use the IMG button to insert it?

I'd like to see the paint job.

What you have described sounds very unprofessional. You should wash the car thoroughly, so that it is clean, and then take a friend with you and take the car back to the body shop on a sunny day and show them the problems. If I were you, I would have my friend taking pictures of the paint, while you and the owner or manager are inspecting it. Also take a picture of the body shop itself, as in their sign.

Did your pant job come with a satisfaction guarantee?

If so, have that with you also and point it out.

Find out what they are wet-sanding and then buffing the finish with. If it were mine, I would ONLY want the Meguiar's Nikken Finishing Papers used, followed by Meguiar’s diminishing abrasive compounds and cleaner/polishes with foam pads.

Look around their shop and see what they're using for sanding papers, compounds and buffing pads. This will tell you pretty quickly how much they know and car about the buffing process.

The paint system and the painter may be the best in the world, but it's the buffing process that either makes, or breaks a great paint job.

Mike

[flyers51285]

i work in a body shop detailing cars and all the little "noggies" in your paint is dirt. sometimes the shopes get behind when it comes to cleaning out the paint booth and there is alot of dust or lose dirt particiles that will stick to the paint when its wet. When ever there is dirt in the paint it must be wet sanded out then buffed. So oppviously whoever detailed your car after it was painted didnt tell the painter there were dirt in it. At my shop its the painters responisblity to wetsand the dirt out then buff it up. your other problum with the swrils is alot of people cant use a rotary buffer well and because the paint is so soft it is very easy to scratch it. There is no reason u have to wait a mounth, bring the car back now and tell them to have it sanded and buffed wth clean pads by some one who knows what they are doing

[rusty bumper]

I agree with flyers...You shouldn't have to wait a month!...That's ridiculous.

[SteveT]

Wouldn't it be better to buff the paint out yourself? If they are just swirls wouldn't a PC and a good polish remove them? Why bring it back to the same idiots? If they knew what they were doing they would have did it right the first time. They will probably screw it up even more than it is. The condition they left the paint in was no accident, it was poor work and there is no reason to think they will do better next time.

[yohan4ws]

Thanks for the advice so far, its greatly appreciated.

I must've put the wrong link above for the photo...


I haven't been able to get a good picture at night of the swirls in the reflection of a street lamp, but they are definately there.

Other bad things:

1) Windshiled wiper nicked the paint under hood because they put the pass. one on the driver side. (reason is the driver wiper was broken and dint want to scratch the new windshield)
2) Windshiled trim is put on with spaces and gaps. Leaks unknown yet.
3) Rear window around trim has exposed red paint still.
4) No under coating behind quarter panels in rear tire wells where rust was repaired.
5) Scratches on roof by plastic trim pieces in grooves.. deep and noticable, probably not through clear.
6) No clear on overspray ... how much clear did they use ????
7) A hair beneath clear on front bumper. (Caused a noogie)
8) ***'t buff marks,
9) Edges are rough on hood edges and other edges on car
10) putty still stuck on windows
11) overspray not even attemptd to be cleaned up and this really hard stuff stuck to my windows.
12) Rear View Mirror still not mounted because a spring was lost so it wont stay tight. (I'm Supposed to come in today to fix that)
13) In the base coat there is 1 white spec buried in the clear.
14) My shamoi was put in my trunk WET on top of my upward facing subwoofer ... Carpet soaked, grill rusted, puddle of water in the subwoofer, screws holding subwoofer rusted.
^^ The shamoi was on the pass. floor and I was opting to not use it on the new paint for fear of swirls .. seeing as it was put back wet I think they used it on the car AFTER they polished it to wash off compound etc. If this is so, this shamoi was sitting on the floor of my car through all prep work, as well was put there wet on top of dirt/gravel in the floor matt when I dropped it off to them.

If they did use the dirty shamoi then they really messed up and made a really really bad call but not drying a freshly painted car with at least a CLEAN 100% cotton terry towel ..

I've yet to develop the disposable camera I gave them, there's pictures of the metal work being done ..

Would Meguiars #9 swirl remover and an 8" wen orbital buffer take out the swirls ?? (5200opm) (specs on buffer can be found www.canadiatire.ca search for wen buffer)

The scratches on the hood are fairly deep and I am not going to ash the car until the shop sees it so they can't say I fudged up washing it .. I got a california duster to keep the dust off as its parked in an alley .. luckily the paint is consisten, no runs etc. and color went on even ..

What should I ask the shop do for me ?? I'd prefer to wait a month for the paint to cure for risk fo further damage and dont have a lot of faith in their skills at this time either .. I will keep you updated with progress when I talk to the shop and find out if they used that shamoi.

Here's more pictures of the car in the shop, and outside after completion

[rusty bumper]

You need to contact the local BBB, and go up the chain of command if you have to and demand a refund of your money!

How does a place like that stay in business??

[Beercan31]

You can only Fleece and Flogg people for so long before you get what you give.

http://www.meguiarsonline.com/gallery/data/500/528complaintdept_1_.gif

[Spotty-Dog]

Originally posted by Beercan31
[B]You can only Fleece and Flogg people for so long before you get what you give.

It occurs to me that this is a case for capital punishment if ever I heard one

[Mike Phillips]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by yohan4ws
[B]Thanks for the advice so far, its greatly appreciated.

I must've put the wrong link above for the photo...


Hi yohan4ws,

First off, I went to where you were hosting your pictures and captured the one above and uploaded it into your gallery. Those scratches are not swirl scratches caused by any machine buffing by something coming into contact with your finish and instilling scratches in an up and down motion.

At least that's how they look from the picture.

Second of all, changing colors on a car is a monumental job, at least to do it right and to have it look good. There are so many problems outlined above that you might be best off showing this list to the owner first and if this doesn't get you anywhere, then perhaps it's time to consult with an attorney.

As far as buffing with #9 removing the above scratches? You could try, but they look like they will take at least #83 DACP, it depends on how deep they are.

Also, as time goes by, your paint will become harder, making removing any defects more difficult. Your best bet is to try to have any buffing work done as soon as possible. Don't let the body shop people make you think you don't know anything about paint work, tell them you hang out on Meguiar’s Online and have in fact posted the results from their work on our forum to discuss.

Of course, this won't do much good if they're not web-savvy.

Mike

[Tim Lingor]

Hey,

After viewing your photo, I have to agree with Mike. I would even suggest that those marks may require the use of a rotary buffer and a skilled user to remove them.

Moreover, your list of issues is incredible! Perhaps a lawyer is in order.


Tim

[yohan4ws]

* Update * I did talk to the shop today ... They said they'd do the undercoat for sure but for the rest of everything as far as touching up was .. "We'll see" .. so if I have to get agressive when I'm there I will .. He said "Well as far as the quality of the job we do good work and if you know how (my friend) is and you've seen his cars you know how picky he is .. " .. really seems like they wanted to have my blue car look sweet on the outside and get this "kid" out of the paintshop...

Per the scratches above, those aren't the swirls I'm referring to. There's more just like it (and just as deep .. and by deep I can see indentation in the clear and feel it when I run my fingernail over it very rigid) I haven't been able to get a picture of the swirls in the night light / sunlight ... but there was a post on here, i think with the viper and you could see the swirl pattern .. its just like that. A real shame on such a brilliant metallic color

I asked if they used the shamoi and they said they washed the car really well and soaked it super heavy after they buffed it and probably some water got in the trunk but said nothin about using the dirty shamoi ..

I was told the above scratches are from the electric /air hose from the buffer.. . Theres similar scratches along the top of the driver side door and the pass. side higher up on the roof ...

Would I be out of line to tell them to re-spray the area's (hood/fender in pass. engine bay jam / rear window) and then sand it / re-clear it ?? ... there are also area's that look like untouched rock chips where its sunken through the clear and base coat ... I was told that this is from them not properly filling / sanding before putting on the base coat ..

If the shop doesn't want to cooperate is a lawyer really the only way to get a quality job(or money back) out of these guys?

I'm going to be super anal about how they repair the rust, I want them to put some sort of Rust inhibator / stop rust type product on the bare metal after scraping off all the rust/dirt/paint/existing undercoat that is there .. and then putting some type of hammerrite or POR-15 product as the final sealant ..

[rusty bumper]

If these guys don't cooperate with you, then you should find another bodyshop to fix the problem, and then take the other guys to small claims court.