how important is polish for hydration?

[wifpd4]

Re: how important is polish for hydration?

...

This is one of the reasons foe using the wipe-down process

If you wouldn't mind, please elaborate on "wipe-down process". What is it, what types of product(s) would be used and where does it fit into this work flow on a modern clear coat and synthetic wax? Is it different if carnauba wax is used?

1. Wash
2. Clay
3. Clean/Correct
4. Polish
5. Synthetic Wax
6. Synthetic Wax

Trying to catch the drift here, but the implication is polish on a modern clear coat provides no useful function to hydrate and may actually interfere with the bonding of synthetic wax.

[OhioCarBuff]

Re: how important is polish for hydration?

I would think that the micro fissures being filled in with oil would have a protective effect- I'm thinking along the lines of water not being able to enter the micro fissures to further corrode the paint and cause them to get larger. I hope someone from meguiars chimes in on this. For what I've been using Meguiars polishes on all my families cars since 1996 and for ever day drivers it has always made the paint look like brand new forever. One of my cars now is a 12 year old every day driver and the paint still has a like new luster from years of meguiars polishes

[Blazebro]

Re: how important is polish for hydration?

^ That's why we have glazes.

[therdrman]

Re: how important is polish for hydration?

That's really a bit too simplistic. Fully correcting a painted surface will bring out it's beauty.

Using a polish by hand will correct very little, mostly just cleansing the surface.

Hitting the paint with a rotary and the correct or even numerous grades of polish will bring out the paints beauty. Depending on how bad the paint is you may have to wet sand the paint and then use a number of grades of polish, reducing in aggressiveness to fully bring out the paints beauty.

yes that is true. but for people who just want to make their paint look good and it is simple. just add polish but your right it just takes wayy longer

[TOGWT]

Re: how important is polish for hydration?

If you wouldn't mind, please elaborate on "wipe-down process". What is it, what types of product(s) would be used and where does it fit into this work flow on a modern clear coat and synthetic wax? Is it different if carnauba wax is used?

1. Wash
2. Clay
3. Clean/Correct
4. Polish
5. Synthetic Wax
6. Synthetic Wax

Trying to catch the drift here, but the implication is polish on a modern clear coat provides no useful function to hydrate and may actually interfere with the bonding of synthetic wax.

Isopropyl alcohol also known as IPA, is readily available at 70 or 90% strength and is excellent for removing oils / grease from paintwork before applying your final sealant or wax after polishing, or used to clean stone chips before painting.

Use at full strength or as a dilute aqueous solution with distilled water. Wiping the finish with a micro fibre cloth you may feel that the swirls have been removed, only to have them reappear after the surface has been washed. After polishing a section, mist and wipe to fully remove residues and reveal the true paint finish.

Nothing worse than a client having paid for paint renovation to wash the paint surface and then have paint marring reappear

[wOlfy]

Re: how important is polish for hydration?

Polishing (compounding not included) is what brangs out the shine & wax enhances & protects that shine.

For those that's been in the military think of how many times you had to POLISH opposed to WAX your boots

[wifpd4]

Re: how important is polish for hydration?

Isopropyl alcohol also known as IPA, is readily available at 70 or 90% strength and is excellent for removing oils / grease from paintwork before applying your final sealant or wax after polishing, or used to clean stone chips before painting.

Use at full strength or as a dilute aqueous solution with distilled water. Wiping the finish with a micro fibre cloth you may feel that the swirls have been removed, only to have them reappear after the surface has been washed. After polishing a section, mist and wipe to fully remove residues and reveal the true paint finish.

Nothing worse than a client having paid for paint renovation to wash the paint surface and then have paint marring reappear

Meguiar's has always said polishing is an optional step. Using IPA as a method of defect identification is one thing, but the implication or inference that polish will interfere with the adherence of a synthetic wax, to me at least, is a concern regarding fundamental product compatibility. It's been stated modern and youthful clear coat receives no benefit from the oils in polish. In this current discussion, I'm hearing a contradiction about synthetic wax bonding to a polished clear coat.

[Blazebro]

Re: how important is polish for hydration?

Polishing (compounding not included) is what brangs out the shine & wax enhances & protects that shine.

For those that's been in the military think of how many times you had to POLISH opposed to WAX your boots

How many times have we heard a wax being called a polish and a polish being called a wax??????

Also does boot polish remove a micron of the boots surface, or is it a case that it's providing protection???? So are you infact waxing/sealing your boots???

[TOGWT]

Re: how important is polish for hydration?

Meguiar's has always said polishing is an optional step. Using IPA as a method of defect identification is one thing, but the implication or inference that polish will interfere with the adherence of a synthetic wax, to me at least, is a concern regarding fundamental product compatibility. It's been stated modern and youthful clear coat receives no benefit from the oils in polish. In this current discussion, I'm hearing a contradiction about synthetic wax bonding to a polished clear coat.

A polymer will form a strong bond with another clean polymer (urethane paint) surface; it will not bond well with metal. Modern automobile paints are formulated from polymer urethane; clear coat is either a low volatile organic compound (VOC) or a water-based paint with no pigmentation.

A polymer sealant will form a molecular bond (cross-linking) with urethane paint, the only exception to this is a silicone polymer, as its oil-based, and like all oils it would act as a barrier and negatively impact with the durability and performance

[sleepy]

Re: how important is polish for hydration?

Excellent post Guys!!

[prbrianpr]

Re: how important is polish for hydration?

wellIm not in that geek about waxing, etc.. I only know by physics:

1. Polishing is reffered to cutting paint (compounding) or using a glaze.
2. Compounding or cutting is to use a polish to remove a thin film of paint. It have micro abrasives I will say it have micro rocks that will collide with the paint molecules and take out paint molecules. This old layer of molecules is removed by the " micro rocks" in the polish so a new layer of paint can see the light of the sun so you can see it.
3. A polish talking about glaze is oils to penetrate the pores of the paint. This can hide paint swirls (very very small swirls) and fill pores so in the big picture the paint seems smoother and shiny. Is like putting oil in your skin.
4. For reflective and shiny surface you want it to be the smooth posible like a plane but really the paint surface is very bumpy like Grand Canyon in molecular view, you want it like a ocean without waves.
5. Finally you want a wax layer to protect the finish and luckly brings more shine.

When it comes to shine polish and glaze the paint, if you want protection not polish a lot, you dont want to remove a layer of paint frequently and use a good sealant.

I prefer shine over protection, I dont mind wax the car every month, so if the wax not stick to paint I really not mind. Also i use Ultimate wash and wax, not remove the wax and feels oily, not wax is removed during wash.

[wifpd4]

Re: how important is polish for hydration?

A polymer will form a strong bond with another clean polymer (urethane paint) surface; it will not bond well with metal. Modern automobile paints are formulated from polymer urethane; clear coat is either a low volatile organic compound (VOC) or a water-based paint with no pigmentation.

A polymer sealant will form a molecular bond (cross-linking) with urethane paint, the only exception to this is a silicone polymer, as its oil-based, and like all oils it would act as a barrier and negatively impact with the durability and performance

Star Kicker, paraphrasing just a little, I believe you are saying if I were to use a polish that contained this ingredient, POLY(DIMETHYLSILOXANE), it would negatively impact with the durability and performance of a synthetic wax such as M21 Synthetic Sealant 2.0.

And/or are you saying if I were to use a polish that contained "light distillate" or "hydrotreated distillate", it would negatively impact the durability and performance of a synthetic wax such as M21 Synthetic Sealant 2.0.

Understanding chemical or mechanical bonding is beyond my comprehension, but in simple terms I do want to understand if I use polish "A" under wax "B", wax "B's" effectiveness will be diminished. Getting older and grayer, longevity starts to outweigh shininess in one's work flow.

[TOGWT]

Re: how important is polish for hydration?

Understanding chemical or mechanical bonding is beyond my comprehension, but in simple terms I do want to understand if I use polish "A" under wax "B", wax "B's" effectiveness will be diminished. Getting older and grayer, longevity starts to outweigh shininess in one's work flow.

I'm not entirly sure what these are; "light distillate" or "hydrotreated distillate", and it would be very difficult to know which or if either one were used in a polish

Bonding- CliffNotes® Version (If you need a more detailed write-up on "Bonding" send me a PM, for bondage I suggest you use google )

Polymers form a molecular bond with one another i.e. a polymer will bond (cross-link) with (polymer) urathene clear coat

Oil will interfere with the bonding (cross-linking) of a polymer (this would include a synthetic wax) and negatively affect its durability

An organic or non-synthetic wax doesn’t bond (cross-link) it forms a ‘hard’ shell, oil will not have a negative effect on these waxes

[prbrianpr]

Re: how important is polish for hydration?

I dont think that is a good idea use glaze with sealants or synthetic, they are more for carnauba, resin, silicones waxes. Still not hurts try it.

[wifpd4]

Re: how important is polish for hydration?

I'm not entirly sure what these are; "light distillate" or "hydrotreated distillate", and it would be very difficult to know which or if either one were used in a polish

Bonding- CliffNotes® Version (If you need a more detailed write-up on "Bonding" send me a PM, for bondage I suggest you use google )

Polymers form a molecular bond with one another i.e. a polymer will bond (cross-link) with (polymer) urathene clear coat

Oil will interfere with the bonding (cross-linking) of a polymer (this would include a synthetic wax) and negatively affect its durability

An organic or non-synthetic wax doesn’t bond (cross-link) it forms a ‘hard’ shell, oil will not have a negative effect on these waxes

"light distillate" or "hydrotreated distillate" are ingredients of some popular POLISHES as indicated by their MSDS. I wondered if they were the OIL you refer to in this sentence:

Oil will interfere with the bonding (cross-linking) of a polymer (this would include a synthetic wax) and negatively affect its durability.

Therefore if those were oils in a polish, then it follows those polishes should not be used under a synthetic wax, such as M21.

Bonding I may not get, bondage I understand thanks!!