My Ultimate Experience

[Mongoose]

Re: My Ultimate Experience

no need it streaks something fierce, I applied 2 coats on my black Cadillac and was quite surprised at how blotchy it actually was. A few passes with some QD took care of it. I hope I didn't take the wax off with the QD. It looks great adds depth so no issues there.

Did you apply by hand or with a d/a?

[MIAdragon]

Re: My Ultimate Experience

Did you apply by hand or with a d/a?

by hand.

[Woodie6250]

Re: My Ultimate Experience

I got to use Ultimate Paste Wax for the first time on my dark metallic blue car this past weekend. I only did the hood as I was simply wanting to test the new products.

I did an IPA wipe down of the hood to remove any remaining wax/sealant for previous applications and then did one pass with Ultimate Polish using the G220 + finishing pad. I applied the UW by hand, let it set up for +-20 minutes and then wiped it off. It wiped off very easy with no towel grab and left a slick finish, but the finish did look blotchy. I was tempted to grab some Last Touch to wipe the surface and get rid of the blotches, but i resisted and left the finish as is as I wanted to see what would happen over a period of time.

I parked the car in the garage and left the wax to cure overnight. The next morning the finish was uniform with no sign of blotchiness or streaking, so I guess the product just needs some time to set up properly.

[Michael Stoops]

Re: My Ultimate Experience

Ultimate Liquid Wax is quite different from anything we've made before, and so it can, under some conditions, behave a bit differently. If you're experiencing some streaking or unevenness try applying it to a panel and wiping off after just a couple of minutes. Yes, this seems to go contrary to what we've been telling you for years, but technology marches on and this is a very different product than any of our previous waxes.

We are seeing no reduction in longevity with a short dry interval at this point. Otherwise, as Shawn pointed out, any streaking should resolve itself after several hours of cure time on it's own.

[boblav]

Re: My Ultimate Experience

I applied Ultimate Liquid Wax to my beige 2008 GMC Sierra pickup last weekend. I had recently washed, clayed, Ultimate Polish then M-21, both with the DA, so the truck was already looking good. I applied UW by hand, it was somewhat streaky in areas where I applied the UW to heavy, so I spread it out and the streaks went away. I waited about 15 minutes, and it removed easily, and quickly, leaving a nice super slick surface. The added pop from the metallic is incredible!

No comments on durability yet, its too soon to tell.

I can't wait to do my other cars and my Harley with UW!

[Thomas S.]

Re: My Ultimate Experience

Does the Ultimate Wax work as the NXT 2.0 does? Because frankly, the NXT 2.0 works more like a sealant than a wax, doesn't it? I apply a layer of pure wax, like the MG#16 on top of the NXT.

If the UW doesn't seal the paint, I would say that the NXT will last longer.

Correct me if I'm wrong.

[k3ith]

Re: My Ultimate Experience

Ultimate Wax, like NXT, is a sealant. I love megs, but I have to say, it's a bit insulting to the consumer to think they have to keep calling a sealant a wax. Consumers are educated by now and, if Megs doesn't think so, they should spend the required marketing money on a consumer educational campaign. It's just getting to the point of silliness. Again, huge megs fan here, but someone at the marketing / ad agency needs a poke in the stomach.

[Markus Kleis]

Re: My Ultimate Experience

Ultimate Wax, like NXT, is a sealant. I love megs, but I have to say, it's a bit insulting to the consumer to think they have to keep calling a sealant a wax. Consumers are educated by now and, if Megs doesn't think so, they should spend the required marketing money on a consumer educational campaign. It's just getting to the point of silliness. Again, huge megs fan here, but someone at the marketing / ad agency needs a poke in the stomach.

k3ith,

As an automotive journalist, I deal daily with figuring out how to write news to appeal to the proper audience. I follow so much with automotive news that I feel like the main points simply must be common knowledge for the "public," but invariably when I open discussions with strangers 9 times out of 10 people have no idea about things that are repeated so often in automotive news it makes me want to scream.

You, me and most (definitely not all) of the MOL users may know the difference between a wax and a sealant, but the general buying public definitely does not.

As for attempting to educate the public on the difference, it sadly is not that simple. Meguiar's could quite literally spend HUNDREDS OF MILLIONS of dollars attempting to do so in the U.S. alone, and I absolutely guarantee you that you would still have the vast majority of consumers not knowing the difference. (And really, what's the point?)

It isn't meant to be insulting at all by calling a sealant a wax, and honestly, I don't even see the need for the distinction for a consumer product. People who typically buy consumer grade waxes/sealants just want something to put on their car once or twice a year to make it look good and "protect it," and they not only could care less how you classify it, they wouldn't appreciate the difference either.

At the end of the day, you know the difference between a wax and a sealant and if you want to use one type of product or the other, you have the knowledge to do so. For those who don't know the difference between the two, keeping things simple and labeling it a wax is far and away the best and most logical (and profitable) choice.

When you see a sealant labeled as a wax, just smile and be proud that you know enough to spot the technical differences

[Alfisti]

Re: My Ultimate Experience

One could define a sealant as a synthetic wax (if you close one eye, tilt your head slightly and take long deep breaths )

[Thomas S.]

Re: My Ultimate Experience

One could define a sealant as a synthetic wax (if you close one eye, tilt your head slightly and take long deep breaths )

Hehe...

[Michael Stoops]

Re: My Ultimate Experience

Ultimate Wax, like NXT, is a sealant. I love megs, but I have to say, it's a bit insulting to the consumer to think they have to keep calling a sealant a wax. Consumers are educated by now and, if Megs doesn't think so, they should spend the required marketing money on a consumer educational campaign. It's just getting to the point of silliness. Again, huge megs fan here, but someone at the marketing / ad agency needs a poke in the stomach.

Come and sit in with our Customer Care team on the phones one day - you'll get a real eye opener!! Many of the people who call in are totally and completely uninformed, or just downright confused. We get calls all the time asking if Gold Class is safe to use on clear coat, or if you really need to wash a car before using Cleaner Wax because, well, it's a cleaner, right? Seriously. Heck, even on detailing forums, people often say they've just waxed their car, now they need to seal it, and ask which sealant to use. And you'd think, since they're hanging out on a detailing forum, that would be fairly clear to them - waxes and sealants serve the same purpose; you don't need both. Sure, sealants almost always outlast traditional waxes, but in the grand scheme of things, they are the final protectant you apply to the paint after going through the defect removal and polishing steps. Nothing more, nothing less.

One could define a sealant as a synthetic wax (if you close one eye, tilt your head slightly and take long deep breaths )

Honestly, you don't even have to try that hard - because that is essentially what a sealant is. Maybe a better way to state it is that sealants are 100% synthetic protectants that serve as a substitute for traditional waxes.

[k3ith]

Re: My Ultimate Experience

Mark and Michael,

Please receive my comments knowing I mean no disrespect. I just see things a bit differently in this regard. Further, I didn't take time to choose my words carefully above, which is a habit I need to break. Really, I didn't expect you to reply at all because I figured you agreed on some level.

In my short experience I have seen meg's trying multiple tactics ranging from naming products based on their results (SwirlX), to creating proprietary descriptive terminology ("tech" wax), to more straight forward descriptions (Ultimate Compound). These are vastly different marketing approaches and, based on this, it appears Meg's is searching for an answer.

In fact, the product naming in this category is so broad that one has to ask the question; have the market share leaders created the confusion that has lead to some of the calls you are referring to and the recurring posts on these forums that seek clarification? After all, what the consumer knows today is largely a result of how the market leaders have educated them in the past. It seems that there is an opportunity for a leader to properly educate the consumer and build tremendous brand loyalty in the process - and there is risk for those brands who don't. Which is the heart of what I was saying in my previous post.

I could go on here and attempt to debate most of the points you guys have made above - attempting to provide you an alternate viewpoint because, like I see with many of my actual clients, you guys are so close to the issue that it is healthy for you to hear an outside view.

However, this is not the venue for a user like me to counter your statements. I fear my comments could be seen by the community as negatives towards Meg's products or you guys personally when, in fact, they are and would be simply discussion points regarding the marketing of great products and helpful service.

In the end, I really just enjoy and appreciate a real marketing challenge like you guys have on your hands here.

[Markus Kleis]

Re: My Ultimate Experience

Mark and Michael,

Please receive my comments knowing I mean no disrespect. I just see things a bit differently in this regard. Further, I didn't take time to choose my words carefully above, which is a habit I need to break. Really, I didn't expect you to reply at all because I figured you agreed on some level.

In my short experience I have seen meg's trying multiple tactics ranging from naming products based on their results (SwirlX), to creating proprietary descriptive terminology ("tech" wax), to more straight forward descriptions (Ultimate Compound). These are vastly different marketing approaches and, based on this, it appears Meg's is searching for an answer.

In fact, the product naming in this category is so broad that one has to ask the question; have the market share leaders created the confusion that has lead to some of the calls you are referring to and the recurring posts on these forums that seek clarification? After all, what the consumer knows today is largely a result of how the market leaders have educated them in the past. It seems that there is an opportunity for a leader to properly educate the consumer and build tremendous brand loyalty in the process - and there is risk for those brands who don't. Which is the heart of what I was saying in my previous post.

I could go on here and attempt to debate most of the points you guys have made above - attempting to provide you an alternate viewpoint because, like I see with many of my actual clients, you guys are so close to the issue that it is healthy for you to hear an outside view.

However, this is not the venue for a user like me to counter your statements. I fear my comments could be seen by the community as negatives towards Meg's products or you guys personally when, in fact, they are and would be simply discussion points regarding the marketing of great products and helpful service.

In the end, I really just enjoy and appreciate a real marketing challenge like you guys have on your hands here.

I appreciate your reply Keith, well said.

As for the original suggestion about wax/sealant and where the consumer market lies, if you want to humor yourself, try this...

Go to your local Wal-Mart automotive section and sit and wait for people coming to shop detailing supplies. Then politely ask them if they can explain the difference between a wax and a sealant to you.

Make a note of how many can vs can't. It might surprise you

[Michael Stoops]

Re: My Ultimate Experience

Please receive my comments knowing I mean no disrespect.

We completely understand your viewpoint, Keith, and we actually appreciate the feedback! Had this thread not been started by you we would probably be apologizing to the original poster for the threadjack, and asking to take this discussion to another thread - but it's your post and you sort of brought this discussion up, so we hope you don't mind if we continue it here for a bit.

I just see things a bit differently in this regard.

That's because your knowledge of this game is far beyond that of the "average consumer" it isn't funny. Honestly! We find there is an enormous difference between the "average consumer" and the enthusiasts who frequent detailing forums.

Further, I didn't take time to choose my words carefully above, which is a habit I need to break. Really, I didn't expect you to reply at all because I figured you agreed on some level.

Actually, your words appeared to have been chosen more carefully than a lot of people would! And we do agree with you on some levels here, but it's a tough call sometimes. Obviously neither we nor anyone else can truly market to the "lowest common denominator" but we can't go over too many people's heads, either. Heck, just look at Ultimate Protectant - it's a lotion format product that does an outstanding job on interior surfaces, but since it's not a spray product people don't understand how to use it on their interiors. So we're repositioning it as an exterior trim product under the name Ultimate Black, and introducing Ultimate Protectant in spray form. Essentially the same stuff, but people are so set with regards to what to use where, it confuses them when something changes.

You brought up a very pointed comment, however, when you said

In fact, the product naming in this category is so broad that one has to ask the question; have the market share leaders created the confusion that has lead to some of the calls you are referring to and the recurring posts on these forums that seek clarification?

To some degree, perhaps that is the case. It's funny to us when we read comments on other forums along the lines of "Meguiar's uses the word "polish" in a strange way, because to everyone else it means an abrasive product that removes defects". That's funny to us because we've been using the word "polish" that way since 1901 - long before the founders of most of our competition were even born! And that just gets further confused when Zaino calls their sealant a polish (although we see a lot of folks referring to wax as polish), and Nu Finish calls their product "the once a year car polish", hinting at long lasting protection - but "polish" and "protection" rarely go hand in hand where enthusiasts are concerned. Meguiar's has been very consistent here since day one.

The word "paint sealant" didn't really come into vogue until the advent of fully synthetic products, obviously, but even that is primarily on discussion forums. When the "average consumer" gets wind of the term the level of confusion can be astounding! They all know they need to wax their car, but now someone mentions "sealant" without saying it's basically a synthetic wax, and the confusion starts. Unfortunately, a product label really isn't the place to try and educate the consumer, even though intuitively it may seem to be.

So, if using the term "wax" on a product that is fully synthetic is borderline insulting to the enthusiast, we certainly don't intend that. Rather, we know the enthusiast has the knowledge and experience to understand what's really going on, and we don't want to create more confusion for the consumer who just wants to wax their new car.

[mongo]

Re: My Ultimate Experience

How is M21v2 and Ultimate wax different and does it last longer that it.

thanx Richard