#80 hazing on Black Paint

[medwards]

I have purchased some #80 to use on my black 2004 Mazda RX8 which has some slight swirling.

I am quite new to "detailing", and am a little concerned about inflicting hazing to my paint by using #80. The paint is in very good condition as its been NXTed since new, and Ive started topping it with #16 which seems to make it repel any water marks for longer (it rains a lot here in the UK).

I will be doing all the work by hand.

I would be grateful for any advice about peoples experience with #80,ie pressure, straight or circular etc.

Thanks in advance

Mike

[Mike Phillips]

Originally posted by medwards
I have purchased some #80 to use on my black 2004 Mazda RX8 which has some slight swirling.

I am quite new to "detailing", and am a little concerned about inflicting hazing to my paint by using #80. The paint is in very good condition as its been NXTed since new, and Ive started topping it with #16 which seems to make it repel any water marks for longer (it rains a lot here in the UK).

I will be doing all the work by hand.

I would be grateful for any advice about peoples experience with #80,ie pressure, straight or circular etc.

Thanks in advance

Mike

Hi Mike,

Welcome to Meguiar's Online!

#80 Speed Glaze is very gentle as far as cleaner/polishes go. It uses a very unique diminishing abrasive that breaks down very quickly as you first begin to use it. On most paints, if there is any hazing or marring with this product the culprit is more than likely caused by the application material, (the type of foam), or excess pressure.

Best results with the #80 are achieved when this product is apply by machine, although it can be applied by hand. Since you already have this here's what you should do.

Test this product and your application process in one section, about a foot squared, hopefully a flat horizontal surface that you can easily work on and easily see your results.

First, shake up the #80 Speed Glaze. Then, using a clean, foam applicator pad, like these Hi-Tech Applicator Pad



apply about a teaspoon or so of the #80 to your applicator pad, kind of like I've done here with the ColorX on this applicator pad.



Then spread the product out over the area you're going to work. This is done with a couple of large circular motions. The idea is to spread the product out over the surface you're going to work, and then work the product in starting in one portion of the section and slowly and methodically moving on to new territory after you have cleaned and polished the paint in the area you are currently working.

When you move on to a portion of the section you are working, be sure to overlap your polishing strokes into the previous worked area for uniform cleaning and polishing.

Use gentle pressure this first time. You can rub in circular motions or straight lines, or use a combination of both. I'll guess at rubbing the applicator pad against the finish for about 30 seconds for each portion of the area you are testing.

After you finish applying the #80 to the test section, use a clean, soft microfiber polishing to remove the remaining residue. Don't worry about getting each and every little trace of the #80 off, just remove most of it.

Now apply two thin coats of the NXT Tech Wax allowing each coat to dry to a haze before removing. After you have removed the second coat, inspect the finish in different light and check your results.

If it looks good, better, or great, and you're happy, then repeat this process to the entire car. If it doesn't, then reply here and we'll take another stab at it.


Before you try the above you might want to consider first trying ScratchX in place of the #80 Speed Glaze. This product was formulated specifically for what you want to do by hand.


Remember, swirls are actually scratches in the paint. In order to remove a scratch, you must of course remove a little paint. So to remove swirls you need to use a paint cleaner that gently removes a little paint without instilling its own scratches at the same time.

If this is what some isolated deeper scratches look like in an otherwise flawless finish from a horizontal viewpoint,



Then a horizontal view of swirls would like kind of like this,



This of course is an exploded view, but I think the you get the point. Swirls are hundreds of thousands of tiny scratches in the paint that usually show up in bright light like sunlight when viewed from the right angle.

The point being, whether your swirls are shallow or deep, in order to remove the swirls, you must level the finish until it is completely flat or smooth and to do this you must remove paint at the highest point of the surface until it is equal to the lowest depth of the deepest scratches.

This is where machine cleaning comes in real handy as the machine does all the work and removes paint more evenly than you can remove it using only your hands and an applicator pad. If at all possible, I would recommend applying the #80 Speed Glaze with a dual action polisher.


If you want to try the ScratchX, then here's a tutorial on removing defects with it.

How to remove a defect by hand with ScratchX

Best of luck and keep us posted....


Mike

[medwards]

Thanks for the quick response Mike.

I'll try and give it a try at the weekend (weather permitting), and will keep you posted as to my results.

Mike

[Mike Phillips]

Sounds good...

Mike

[RamAirV1]

I've got to get some #80. My favorite paint cleaner for hand and machine use has been the Medallion Paint Cleaner (MPC). It is more aggressive than Scratch X, so it's good for that hard GM clearcoat. Scratch X is ok but it takes more applications to get out moderate swirls than the MPC. Scratch X works great on bird dropping etch marks for some reason. Scratch X does have the added advantage of providing fillers too. I don't believe MPC has fillers. When I apply MPC with the DA polisher, it is almost as good as #83 DACP, but not quite.

Mike, how aggressive is MPC compared with #80? I have never used #80. My local PBE dealer stocks it and they say it is their most popular product. I suppose the paintable polymers are one reason for that.

RamAirV1

[medwards]

UPDATE

Due to the weather here in the UK, I have just tried #80 on a section of my paint which has these slight swirls / cobwebs.

I applied it with a foam applicator, and spread it over an area of 12" by 12", and rubbed it in with straight strokes, with medium pressure for about 30 secs until it was nearly gone. But it didnt seem to make any improvement . In direct sun, the marks are still visible, (and i'm a bit paraniod that it may have made them a little worse .

I then applied 1 coat of NXT tech wax, then 2 coats of #16, which makes them disappear.

Any more tips on application ???

Ive just ordered some ScratchX, to see if this might do the trick, (aswell as some #81 Hand Polish).

TIA for any feedback.

Mike

[tripper_11]

I'm not Mike but I'll try to give my opinion, as #80 is one of my Megs love.

#80 in order to remove light swirls needs to be applied by machine for the diminishing abrassives to work properly.

I use #80 by hand for glazing purposes only since it is rich in TS oils and leaves a fresh paint-safe polymers that looks unique on its own. I do this not oftener than once month.

But if I want to use #80 to remove light swirls and marring, I use a rotary with the Megs polishing pad in order to work in the abrassives properly.

So as you can see, #80 is a multi-purpose product. It can be a glaze if applied by hand, and it can aslo be an abrassive cleaner and polish in one if applied with machine.

If you want to remove light swirls and marring without a machine, you can use ScratchX as it is designed to be worked in by hand.

[Mike Phillips]

Originally posted by medwards
Any more tips on application ???

Ive just ordered some ScratchX, to see if this might do the trick, (aswell as some #81 Hand Polish).

TIA for any feedback.

Mike

Hi Mike,

Sounds like you paint might be on the soft side? When it comes to removing swirls and scratches with the goal of producing a flawless finish, you pretty much are going to have to invest in some type of machine polisher. What do you have available in the UK?

To create a 100% swirl-free finish requires that you do everything you can to the best of your abilities to remove as many of the deeper defects from the finish as you can using a compound or cleaner/polish. Then using good technique, the correct pad and a finer polish, you re-polish the area and massage out any remaining haze or swirls from the first step.

If you do everything right you can get to about 98% to 99% of the way to your goal of a swirl free finish. In order to take your results over the top to perfection, you will have to re-polish the finish using a machine that oscillates instead of rotates, and/or apply a product that will fill-in and eliminate from your view, the very fine, or shallow swirls that may still remain.

Just to note, achieving perfection on a painted surface will always be influenced by things like paint hardness and/or softness. The harder the paint, the more difficult it will be to massage out each and every defect, while very soft paints will be prone to marring or micro-scratching. There is a sweet spot for paint harness that gives you the best of both worlds, hardness for durability and resistance to deteriorating, yet soft enough that it can be successfully polished. This unfortunately is something you can't control.

Your point of origin, or reference must also be considered. If you start out with a finish that has gross swirls, as in deep swirls possibly instilled by running the car repeatedly through a mechanical car wash, or perhaps it was machine buffed using a wool pad and a compound that doesn't utilize diminishing abrasives, no polish or wax is going to be able to fill-in deep swirls like this and make the paint look good. So if by using a rotary buffer you can effectively remove the deep swirls, scratches, oxidation, etching, (or whatever the defects are), and create a finish that is 99% of the way swirl-free, then the difference between the condition of the finish you started with and the condition of the finish you have created will be dramatic.

Final polishing with the dual action polisher and a fine polish like our #82 Swirl Free Polish or our #9 Swirl Remover 2.0, and even our #80 Speed Glaze, or a good quality polish or wax, (or both), will be enough to carry your results over the top.

It all comes down to the fact that in order to remove a defect you have to touch the surface, (in one way or another), and remove small particles of paint in an effort to level or flatten the surface. The trick then is to use a system that is able to remove defects, without instilling its own defects.

[medwards]

tripper_11

You mention that you use #80 for "glazing" purposes.
How do you do this ?
Do you wipe it on lightly and allow to dry ?
What effect does this give to your paint ?

Thanks

Mike

ps- Ive applied 1 coats of NXT and 2 coats of #16 over a 1 week period. Do you guys recommend leaving alone for a few weeks before applying a polish (#80 or #81) because this will remove the #16 ?

[toyotaowner]

I'm just wondering. Whenever I go to a different section of polishing, shoud I use what ever was absorbed from the previous application or start from a new amount of product? I find that I unnecessarily waste a good amount of product

It took me 3 darn applications with a speed of 4 to get some noticeable difference. And god knows how much product I wasted but, to make my life a bit easier, I think I'll go for #83.

Oh and I ran it off the car battery and guess what? I just got so into that I forgot to check the car and killed the battery.

So, just stick with the extra extra long extension cord.

[RamAirV1]

I would not apply a polish over the wax or sealant unless you are going to a car show. The polish will not last very long and all that work will be wasted. I keep my polish under the sealant.

RamAirV1