VE Holden Commodore SSV exterior detail with DAMF

[Mitch312]

Well another swirled black car in need of some machine polishing. The customer was selling the car and wanted to improve the re sale. He wasn't after the best finish I could get so the Meguiars DAMF would be the weapon of choice. I must say though that the DAMF has really impressed me and truly is a game changer. It's such a simple system that is easy to teach others and a lot safer and cleaner than using a rotary, which I only use rarely now; mainly for gelcoat. So I'll let the pictures show the rest.












There was a slight haze left even after the finishing wax but the customer could not see it when I did a test spot and did a wipe down with glass cleaner so I was not concerned with it. It was a big turn around. For a couple of heavier scratches I used a unigrit 3000 finishing disc before compounding, then just removed the sanding marks when I was compounding the panel.

I do have some questions though for anyone who uses this system with the rupes bigfoot polishers. Does the machine increase your efficiency compared to a standard 8mm da? Do the pads wear out quicker due to the increased stresses? If so what speed do you use? I'm considering getting a 21mm da to improve my efficiency further and was just curious if I could get advice from detailers who use the DAMF with the rupes.

Thanks for viewing.

[GLOCKer]

Re: VE Holden Commodore SSV exterior detail with DAMF

If there were ever any "GM" products I wish I could own, they'd come from Holden (especially the HSV cars!). I'm still a Ford fan and don't want anything else in my garage, but I love Holden cars. It's a shame what's happening to them over there. Wish they had sold them over here in the USA!

Great looking work!

[CCC4me]

Re: VE Holden Commodore SSV exterior detail with DAMF

I do have some questions though for anyone who uses this system with the rupes bigfoot polishers. Does the machine increase your efficiency compared to a standard 8mm da? Do the pads wear out quicker due to the increased stresses? If so what speed do you use? I'm considering getting a 21mm da to improve my efficiency further and was just curious if I could get advice from detailers who use the DAMF with the rupes.

Thanks for viewing.

Nice job on the Holden! I agree that I wish we had them in the US.

I don't own a Rupes, but I do use my Dynabrade (19mm throw) with them all the time. I have not noticed any reduction in life. The only problems I have encountered were with the earliest pads delaminating as they did for many users. The new pads, combined with slightly more frequent pad changes to counter the heat generated by the larger throw, have solved that issue for sure.

[Mitch312]

Re: VE Holden Commodore SSV exterior detail with DAMF

If there were ever any "GM" products I wish I could own, they'd come from Holden (especially the HSV cars!). I'm still a Ford fan and don't want anything else in my garage, but I love Holden cars. It's a shame what's happening to them over there. Wish they had sold them over here in the USA!

Great looking work!

Yer it is a shame. I'm a ford man too but don't mind the commodores (except for when the Bathurst 1000 is on) lol. The good news is the mustang is coming to Australia which is fantastic.

[Mitch312]

Re: VE Holden Commodore SSV exterior detail with DAMF

Nice job on the Holden! I agree that I wish we had them in the US.

I don't own a Rupes, but I do use my Dynabrade (19mm throw) with them all the time. I have not noticed any reduction in life. The only problems I have encountered were with the earliest pads delaminating as they did for many users. The new pads, combined with slightly more frequent pad changes to counter the heat generated by the larger throw, have solved that issue for sure.

Cool. Thanks heaps for your advice

[paulcr39]

Re: VE Holden Commodore SSV exterior detail with DAMF

If there were ever any "GM" products I wish I could own, they'd come from Holden (especially the HSV cars!). I'm still a Ford fan and don't want anything else in my garage, but I love Holden cars. It's a shame what's happening to them over there. Wish they had sold them over here in the USA!

Great looking work!

GM does sell Holden cars in the US. You can get yourself a Chevy SS if you want a new one or a Pontiac G8/GT/GXP if you want a used one.

I can work you a honey of a deal on my 2009 Holden Commodore VE SS aka Pontiac G8 GT. ;^)

[Eldorado2k]

Nice & shiny^

[Michael Stoops]

Re: VE Holden Commodore SSV exterior detail with DAMF

I do have some questions though for anyone who uses this system with the rupes bigfoot polishers. Does the machine increase your efficiency compared to a standard 8mm da? Do the pads wear out quicker due to the increased stresses? If so what speed do you use? I'm considering getting a 21mm da to improve my efficiency further and was just curious if I could get advice from detailers who use the DAMF with the rupes.

As with anything in life, there is both an upside and a downside to a tall stroke tool. A 21mm stoke can be a definite step up in cutting ability, which is great, but the downside to such a tall stroke is that edge work (along trim, under door (wing) mirrors, etc) is very difficult, if not impossible, and even moderate concave surfaces can cause the tool to stop rotating. A shorter stroke tool tends to work better in those types of situations. If you look specifically at the Rupes tools you'll notice that on the LHR15 it actually reads "Detailing". From one of their own engineers they'll tell you that the 15 was designed for detailing and the 21 for body shop work, and primarily for the reasons stated above.

When looking at the overall performance of any DA tool, there are basically 4 things that come into play:

1. Stroke length
2. Speed of the tool
3. Power of the motor
4. Torque

The single biggest factor, though, is torque. Without torque, the other three mean zip.


Regardless how tall the stroke is, if you apply downward pressure and rotation ceases, you lose cut. You need the torque to overcome that downward pressure.

No matter how fast the tool is spinning, if you apply downward pressure and rotation ceases, you lose cut. Virtually all tools produce less torque at slower speeds, which is why you can stop any DA from rotation at slow speed (and it's partially why we apply light pressure when applying wax at very low speeds). At higher speeds, however, you need torque to maintain pad rotation under pressure.

Measuring the power of a motor is a bit tricky, as everyone shows power as a Watt specification. But a watt rating is actually the maximum energy consumed under load without overheating the motor. It does not speak to the efficiency of the motor, or what the motor's output is compared to it's draw. For example, is most of the consumed energy just going out as heat, or is it actually be used to move the pad? Regardless, wattage certainly does not speak to the torque of the tool (amperage is a closer indicator) and again, without torque, power alone won't cut it. Remember, torque is the twisting force that produces rotation, and a polisher is all about rotation. Think of two car lined up for a drag race, both with engines producing 300HP, but with greatly differing torque specs. One is a small displacement naturally aspirated engine making 120lb-ft, the other is a bit larger displacement turbo charged engine making 275lb-ft of torque. Both cars weigh the same and are geared the same. Which one is faster off the line? Yep, the one with the big torque.


Now, take all the above info and think about building a DA polisher. You'd want it to be able to do edge work, that's a given, but you'd also want it to be able to very effectively cut on those larger, flat panels as well. Torque is what allows you to do that, and torque is what we've built into our new MT300 DA polisher. It's still an 8mm stroke, so it still does all the edge work easily and effectively. But with all that torque (plus the ability to spin as high as 7500 opm at the same time) and you suddenly have a very serious defect slayer. Now pair this with a microfiber cutting pad, or our new foam cutting disc, and a serious compound like M100, M101 or M105 and you end up with a seriously efficient and effective defect slayer.

[Mitch312]

Re: VE Holden Commodore SSV exterior detail with DAMF

As with anything in life, there is both an upside and a downside to a tall stroke tool. A 21mm stoke can be a definite step up in cutting ability, which is great, but the downside to such a tall stroke is that edge work (along trim, under door (wing) mirrors, etc) is very difficult, if not impossible, and even moderate concave surfaces can cause the tool to stop rotating. A shorter stroke tool tends to work better in those types of situations. If you look specifically at the Rupes tools you'll notice that on the LHR15 it actually reads "Detailing". From one of their own engineers they'll tell you that the 15 was designed for detailing and the 21 for body shop work, and primarily for the reasons stated above.

When looking at the overall performance of any DA tool, there are basically 4 things that come into play:

1. Stroke length
2. Speed of the tool
3. Power of the motor
4. Torque

The single biggest factor, though, is torque. Without torque, the other three mean zip.


Regardless how tall the stroke is, if you apply downward pressure and rotation ceases, you lose cut. You need the torque to overcome that downward pressure.

No matter how fast the tool is spinning, if you apply downward pressure and rotation ceases, you lose cut. Virtually all tools produce less torque at slower speeds, which is why you can stop any DA from rotation at slow speed (and it's partially why we apply light pressure when applying wax at very low speeds). At higher speeds, however, you need torque to maintain pad rotation under pressure.

Measuring the power of a motor is a bit tricky, as everyone shows power as a Watt specification. But a watt rating is actually the maximum energy consumed under load without overheating the motor. It does not speak to the efficiency of the motor, or what the motor's output is compared to it's draw. For example, is most of the consumed energy just going out as heat, or is it actually be used to move the pad? Regardless, wattage certainly does not speak to the torque of the tool (amperage is a closer indicator) and again, without torque, power alone won't cut it. Remember, torque is the twisting force that produces rotation, and a polisher is all about rotation. Think of two car lined up for a drag race, both with engines producing 300HP, but with greatly differing torque specs. One is a small displacement naturally aspirated engine making 120lb-ft, the other is a bit larger displacement turbo charged engine making 275lb-ft of torque. Both cars weigh the same and are geared the same. Which one is faster off the line? Yep, the one with the big torque.


Now, take all the above info and think about building a DA polisher. You'd want it to be able to do edge work, that's a given, but you'd also want it to be able to very effectively cut on those larger, flat panels as well. Torque is what allows you to do that, and torque is what we've built into our new MT300 DA polisher. It's still an 8mm stroke, so it still does all the edge work easily and effectively. But with all that torque (plus the ability to spin as high as 7500 opm at the same time) and you suddenly have a very serious defect slayer. Now pair this with a microfiber cutting pad, or our new foam cutting disc, and a serious compound like M100, M101 or M105 and you end up with a seriously efficient and effective defect slayer.

Wow thanks heaps for your advice Michael. It makes a lot of sense. I do have a few more questions though. I run a mobile detailing business full time so tools are an investment for me and a tax deductible which is always good My question is, do you think using a 21mm da with the 6.25'' da disc for the larger panels then either using an 8,12 or 15mm da with 5.5'' for the tighter areas followed my say a rupes mini for 3 inch pads is faster than just using an 8mm da with 5.5'' and 3'' pads? I currently a have basically the GG6 (they don't sell them in Aus as far a I know but looks very similar to the old model with similar specs) its got plenty of power and torque though after using it for a few months. I see a lot of people either using the bigfoot tools or the flex 3401 and am just considering investing in one of them. I've heard the forced rotation doesn't work as nicely with the microfiber discs so thought the bigfoots would be the way to go. I still use a rotary when needed, but the technology of dual action polishers and microfiber disc and stuff have found me using it less and less. I work on a lot of just daily drivers so I use the DAMF due to it been very good, easier and safer and most of my customers aren't looking for the best finish possible. Plus da are easier to train employees on and less likely to cause me to have to make an insurance claim.

So in your professional opinion would that be a worthwhile investment?

Appreciate your input already

[GLOCKer]

Re: VE Holden Commodore SSV exterior detail with DAMF

GM does sell Holden cars in the US. You can get yourself a Chevy SS if you want a new one or a Pontiac G8/GT/GXP if you want a used one.

I can work you a honey of a deal on my 2009 Holden Commodore VE SS aka Pontiac G8 GT. ;^)

Sadly, not anymore they don't! (Or at least soon!) Holden is folding in a horrible way. Ford is killing off the big engine rear drive cars too over there from what I remember. It's a sad day!

[roger3380]

Re: VE Holden Commodore SSV exterior detail with DAMF

Looks great