I tried....

[Don]

One of the guys at work has a 1989 Caddy that really needs repainted, but he asked me if I could help him out and try to delay the repaint.

Since he's a friend, I said I'd give it as shot. Unfortunately, I overestimated my abilities. While there was a marked improvement, it's nowhere near what I'd hoped to accomplish.

He seemed happier that the white wasn't as prominant as it was before, but he wants me to 'touch it up' in a week or so. I told him I'd get some heavier cleaner to try again.

Anyway on to the details (no pun intended)

The car is supposed to be a very dark blue. The hood, roof and trunk have SEVERE oxidation and fracturing along with what appears to be heavy scratching...almost like wetsanding marks.

I used ample amounts of DACP & several cutting pads on 6. This did make vast improvements but from the pics, you can see that there is still a lot of oxidation and marring left.

I "finished" with Color-X also on a cutting pad.

When I hit the car again, I intend to try some Fine Cut Cleaner to see if I can bring it to an acceptable level. For now, here is what I I've got:

Hood half & half







Roof before (he tried waxing himself)




Roof after




Hood after

[Mike Phillips]

Hi Don,

Years ago I coined the term, Unstable" to describe paint that is so far gone that it cannot be brought back from the dead.

(Hmmm.... I should somehow make the definition I attribute to the term "Unstable" concrete, before others try to redefine what the term means like I've seen with LSP)


From the before pictures and the after pictures, (the results), I would say that the paint on this car has become unstable. That is it cannot be fully restored, and it's possible any gains you make will be lost and the finish will return to the condition you started with, or at least close to it.

When we did this extreme makeover,

Open Invitation - Mercedes-Benz Extreme Makeover









I actually did one half of the hood a week before the makeover to see if the results would stabilize. The owner was parking this car outside in the middle of a SoCal summer so I figured if a week of harsh sun didn't deteriorate the results, that it would probably be safe to continue with the rest of the car.

It's possible the paint your working on will hold the results you have created, but it's also possible the paint will revert back to how it was when you first started, or close to it.

For single stage paint like this, for a paint cleaner, I personally like to stick with #2 Fine Cut Cleaner, followed with either #3 Machine Glaze by machine, or #7 by hand. You want to gorge that paint with polish in an effort to stabilize it to whatever degree it can be saved.

Good luck!

Mike

[Rick]

Hey for what it's worth it sure looks a lot better than the before you have to consider. When paint is that far gone there really isn't much that can be done, yeah it can be made to look better, but once it's the far gone it's gone. I luckily haven't had to deal with this yet on any sort of client basis, but just for some back me up I acquired a Paint Condition Deck. I think Daimler Chrysler publishes it, but it's also got BASF, PPG, Du Pont, R-M, Autocolor, Spies Hecker, Glasurit, Shermin Willimams, STandox, Meguiar's, Martin Senour Paints, and Sikkens logos on the front of it. So it gives you something to back up what your saying on in the event your trying to tell a customer their expectations are unrealistic. What the deck does is it has pictures of all sorts of common paint conditions with a description of what causes it and what to do about it. That way if something that bad you can just show them that it says the only fix is to repaint.

Now I know your trying to do that for your friend so your obviously going to try your best (who wouldn't). We had a Camaro about a year ago that had sit for I think 20 years and the paint was just gone, pretty much as bad if not worse than the Mercedes Mike has pictured (you gotta look at the post for the before pictures). We hit it with the rotary and got come color back, but the paint was so incredibly weak on the car. Same case, I did my best and it looked much better compared to how it was.

[Don]

Thanks guys, this is a BC/CC paint. In this pic, the small round spot on the left side of the pic is a small spot I did by hand using a terry towel the day before. After using the PC, that spot was nearly perfect. I was thinking that if I could use the #2 with a terry bonnet, I could get the rest of the oxidation off...I was also thinking that some #7 applied heavily and really rubbed in might help too (like you just suggested Mike...warped minds must think alike )




Anyhow, today I have a 2001 Cadillac Catara that's in decent shape. I'll have pics of it tonight.

[Teak]

Have you worked on the Caddy again? Any pics of the Catera? The picture of the roof just makes me speechless.

Mike,
Thanks for the new term.

Edited for grammar: I read here about a detailer who works on boats, mentioned that he worked on boat, which reoxidize before he finished the other side.

Eric

[Mike Phillips]

Originally posted by Teak
Mike,
Thanks for the new term.

I detailer who works on boats, mentioned that he worked on boat which re-oxidize before he finished the other side.Eric

Just to mention...

If a person is working on a fiberglas gel coat that is extremely oxidized with an inexpensive compound, (or anything that contains inexpensive solvents which dry out the paint, then this could easily happen.

Buff that same panel with a Meguiar's product and the polishing oils maybe able to revitalize the gel-coat finish. Buffing dried, up oxidized, unstable surfaces with products that cut or abrade the surface, but don't do anything to re-introduce ingredients like the trade secrete oils in Meguiar's products is usually a recipe for more of the same, i.e. oxidation. The oils in Meguiar's products add richness of color, depth and clarity, whereas solvents just dry things up.

That doesn't mean Meguiar's will fix everything, but what I have found over my lifetime is that if it can be fixed, Meguiar's can fix it. If it can't be fixed, nobody's product will fix it.

Mike

[Teak]

Mike,
It was yachtdetailer who did the boat which reoxidized.
Link to post here:

Since I am off-topic now:
When is your book coming out? As the book will probably have a dictionary of your terms with the correct definition.


Does paint become unstable because the paint system has failed? Possibly due to the lack of care or improper application.

Eric

[Don]

Originally posted by Teak
Have you worked on the Caddy again? Any pics of the Catera? The picture of the roof just makes me speechless.

Eric

Yes, I did the Catera, the owner was so pleased with the results that she doesn't want to drive the car for fear it will get dirty

No, I haven't worked on the blue caddy again yet.

[Teak]

Originally posted by Don
Yes, I did the Catera, the owner was so pleased with the results that she doesn't want to drive the car for fear it will get dirty

I love when that happens.

Eric

[benhui86]

its been 2 months now..... have u done the caddy yet? or did the owner repaint it already...

[Don]

Originally posted by benhui86
its been 2 months now..... have u done the caddy yet? or did the owner repaint it already...

I'm weather dependant, and the weather hasn't been co-operating

[OrangeRcode]

Definite improvement even if it is not the results hoped for. My dad has an old Ford Courier pu I am dying to work on. It has sit outside since the 80s without any type of wax and few washes. It is a yellow color that is practically white from oxidation. I am going to give it shot this spring.

[Mike Phillips]

Originally posted by OrangeRcode
Definite improvement even if it is not the results hoped for. My dad has an old Ford Courier pu I am dying to work on. It has sit outside since the 80s without any type of wax and few washes. It is a yellow color that is practically white from oxidation. I am going to give it shot this spring.

How do you plan on attacking the Ford Courier's finish?

By hand or machine?

Mike

[OrangeRcode]

I just ordered the DAP and basic essentials kit. I figured it was a good place to start as I certainly couldnot hurt the finish any. What do you recommend I begin with?

[Teak]

Don,
Will let us know when you take another stab at the Caddy?

OrangeRcode,
Post pictures of the Courier when you are done, I always like see an extreme make over.

Eric