The Junkman not likeing Meguiar's consumer products?

[Peter.kelly]

Re: The Junkman not likeing Meguiar's consumer products?

Let me toss in another card here... as a long time user of the consumer range.. I would have to say that pound for pound, they are very very effective in doing what they say they will. To me, it stands to reason.. most sales are to guys like me (consumer) and I walk easily if I don't get results. If they don't work, the company can forget about staying alive. Pro sales won't easily sustain it.

Pros necessarily have to be able to produce a 100% result on the material that us consumers can't easily fix. they need products that allow their craftmanship to be expressed and be workable with the tools of their trade.

IMHO a pro with the pro range and tools will always beat the result that I can get with the consumer range by hand. To me that seems natural and the way it should be! The point to me, as a 'Joe Blow' is that I can get a fantastic result with the consumer line - and it truth, I probably get better than I deserve, Lol!

I think the Junkman misses the point.. I believe that anyone good at polishing and detailing will get a great result with many of the products on the market and it will be the amount of work needed to get that finish and subtle final effects that will make the difference for them. For people like me, the equation is different - I want the best I can get in a few hours with no or minimal tools and I believe that I am just one of many in "the thundering horde" like me. For people like me, the Meg's consumer range is just great... I can't easily imagine what they could do to make it better other than a product where I could smile at the car and it would clean itself...
[IMG]file:///d:/newtemp/moz-screenshot-3.png[/IMG]
[IMG]file:///d:/newtemp/moz-screenshot-2.png[/IMG]

[Junkman2008]

Re: The Junkman not likeing Meguiar's consumer products?

He has passion.

When I mentioned M105/M205 in an Adam's sponsored forum he made some comment about not appropriate for American muscle (cars) but more appropriate to negative comment on non-US cars. I think his view is novices remove too much paint in polishing by using too aggressive products by using too aggresive polshes.

Wow, that was a big misquote there Bunky. Whether a car is foreign or domestic has absolutely no bearing whatsoever as to how it will perform. A product has no clue what car or color it is being used on. Thus it will perform up to the user's ability, period. To say that product A works best on one specific color is not logical unless that product has a coloring agent in it that will change the color on the car. I have yet to see anything like that. To say that a product works best on a specific manufacturer's car is just not logically possible. Now if we differentiate between one-stage or two-stage paint jobs, that's a totally different ball of wax.

Allow me to speak for myself on this subject so that everyone is on the same page with my feeling. First off, I travel the show car circuit with Adam's as their detail guy. I show folks how to use the Adam's line because it is very simple in the selection of products. There are 3 polishes and 3 different waxes. That's it. It is very hard for a novice user to get lost in the process when the process will 90% of the time use 2 polishes and one wax. Adam's has even made the pads color to match the products color. Talk about dummy proof, if you can't use this line of products you need to stick to the drive through car wash!

My personal opinion of M105/M205... LOVE IT! You can quote me on that! Now here's my opinion on every professional product on the market.
The thing that kills me about folks who argue about which similar products are best is most guys have no clue about how or where these various products are manufactured. Thus, M205 and Adam's FMP could be the same exact thing chemical wise and yet, guys will argue to their death bed that one is better than the other. I have two theories on that. One (as someone has stated previously), if it works for you, use it! There's no need to reinvent the wheel if the one you have works. Secondly, ANY quality product when used by anyone experienced with that product will always have positive results. If you take two of the same exact car that have been exposed to the same exact elements and have 2 people using 2 different professional line of products that they have extensive experience with, their shine will be exactly the same (that was a really long sentence ). We as end users out here have no access to the manufacturing plants and thus are crazy to fight over what is best among similar products (e.g. Zaino PC Fusion, Adam's SHR and Meguiar's #9). That's why I don't bother to do so. The only thing we have are opinions!

No onto the topic of the Meguiar's consumer line. I am not a fan of consumer products that have fillers in them. This may not be the case with all OTC products, but I know we can agree that there are plenty on the market. My experience with OTC products is quite old as I haven't bought any since the 90's. Products have changed and Meguiar's has came out with a bunch of different products since then. These products may be amazing, however, I have not tried any of them because of my prior experience with the stuff I bought in the past. It is not fair for me to paint all OTC stuff with such a broad brush! I will agree with everyone here on that topic. However, since there is so much garbage out there today and people don't know the decent stuff from the garbage, I direct them to use professional grade products. I am biased in that area concerning Meguiar's as I have a Mirror Glaze distributor a couple of miles from my house. I can drop in at any time and get any profession product that Meguiar's manufactures. Because of this, I am biased to ONLY use the professional line of Meguiar's. That stuff ain;t cheap either. I bought a $160 bucks worth of polishes the other day.

Here is another very important point that I must make concerning my affiliation with Adam's. Adam's Polishes are geared to the guy who just stopped using the drive through car wash. This is why there are not a lot of products to choose from in one given area. Adam's uses the KISS system: keep it simple stupid! When a guy new to the detailing process begins the search for information, he will quickly be overwhelmed because of all the different things being posted at all the different forums. We've all been there! I decided that I was going to help those confused souls out after experiencing this myself. At first, I posted written directions. Those post were WAY TO LONG. That's when I discovered You Tube and decided to make videos. I started with Zaino, then moved to Meguiar's. Then I was turned on to Adam's. Clay, polish, polish, wax and walk away. Top it off with the fact that it worked! It just didn't get any simpler than that. People caught on to the videos and the process quickly and thus, I decided to use that brand as my teaching tool. It makes a great introduction to proper car care and from there, a novice can expand or continue with what works for them. There it is. This is why I use Adam's products in my videos.

Now allow me to address anyone who thinks that this is all I use. Not even close. Any wet sanding that I do that requires 2500 grit paper starts moving me out of the Adam's line and into the Meguiar's line using my Flex polisher. Once I hit 1500 and lower, I put down my Meguiar's and my Flex and pick up some 3M and my Makita. The products that I use are totally dependent on the damage that I'm addressing! There is no magic bullet and if you are addressing the many situations that you will see as a professional detailer, you MUST be versatile in your product selection! This is why I DO NOT use just one line of product. I have narrowed my choices to the products that I can pick up locally, because we all hate waiting on stuff to ship. Lucky for me, the product I have immediate access to work.

Here's another revelation. I do NOT detail cars for a living. It doesn't remotely pay enough for the lifestyle I live. In my opinion, detailers are raked across the coals with how little they charge and are paid if they are truly doing the job right. If I do a total paint correction on a sports car the size of my Corvette, I would need at least 3 weeks and no less than $2000. I'm a computer consultant and have made that much in 2 days so for me to sweat like a detailer, it is going to cost somebody! That keeps the line short at my garage for total paint corrections! I do open my garage for free to ANYONE with paint issues who are looking for directions to getting it fixed. I love this stuff and if I was rich, I would do it for free. It's just too bad it doesn't pay enough.

If you are still reading this then your eyes are probably hurting so I'll wrap it up. The Junkman doesn't hate on other professional products but because of all the jusk on the OTC market, steers others away from them. It'a a bit of "guilt by association" (which I know is wrong), but since Meguiar's makes an outstanding professional line, I would rather use and recommend it instead of having someone go out and buy some product that claims to last for 5 years. At every Carlisle show I attend and hold clinics at, the Meguiar's semi is there loaded with a boatload of goodies. The first thing I do is go over and say hey to the guys as we all know each other well. There is nothing but an opportunity to continue learning from your fellow enthusiast, no matter what product they use. They were the first to turn me on to M105 and M205. Had we not been friends, I wouldn't have found out about those products when I did.

Thanks for taking the time to read "War & Peace". I hope I didn't exceed the word count. I'll find out when I hit the "submit" button!

[imacarnut]

Re: The Junkman not likeing Meguiar's consumer products?

Most importantly.. it's not what's on the outside of these bottles, but what's in the inside that counts.

[Markus Kleis]

Re: The Junkman not likeing Meguiar's consumer products?

Show me a better consumer line of products on store shelves today....

Exactly. Obviously consumer products aren't the "end all, be all," but that is why Meguiar's has an enormously versatile and expansive list of products and product lines.

I know other companies out there many some fantastic consumer products, but I still think (now more than ever) Meguiar's has the most complete and competitive line of consumer-friendly products out there.

Now, just like the age old "What is the best wax?" debate, this too will be filled with debate because it is based largely on OPINION.

junkman is welcome to his, just like we are all welcome to ours.

Let's just make sure to remain respectful when sharing them

PS- Mike, your post (with the check) is absolutely classic and speaks volumes about your abilities and what they can translate into with some simple, yet quality products.

[1970judge]

Re: The Junkman not likeing Meguiar's consumer products?

I've been detailing my own and my relative's cars as practice cars for quite some time using ONLY consumer line products. I've been doing it on the side since I started college for extra money. I have had nothing but good luck.

[Bunky]

Re: The Junkman not likeing Meguiar's consumer products?

I agree. The Junkman's videos are great. He has a passion for detailing.

He has passion.

When I mentioned M105/M205 in an Adam's sponsored forum he made some comment about not appropriate for American muscle (cars) but more appropriate to negative comment on non-US cars. I think his view is novices remove too much paint in polishing by using too aggressive products by using too aggresive polshes.

[tcope1]

Re: The Junkman not likeing Meguiar's consumer products?

Since this thread asks the question of what I/we think of the consumer line I'll chime in. I've used Scratch X (both versions) as well as Ultimate Compound. They are both great products. I can't compare them to too many other non-megs products but they work, they work very well, and they do _exactly_ as they are supposed to do.

Do other companies make good products? I'm sure they do... otherwise they would not still be in business.

I don't see any problems with Megs Consumer line. I also don't see why you'd fault the consumer line over the Professional line.

It's obvious that JM is promoting Adams products (watching any of the videos clearly shows this). That is just fine. He likes Adams over Megs, that is fine as well. I think his videos are _great_! No question about that.

As in another "wax" thread... we use what we like. I see no problem with Megs Consumer line not doing what it should.

[Mike Phillips]

Re: The Junkman not likeing Meguiar's consumer products?

Here's the real deal...

Assuming a product line works, regardless of whether or not it's in a companies Professional Line, Consumer Line or a Boutique Line via the Internet, if the product line works then whether a person can get great results will come down to the skill, experience and ability of the person using it.

Kind of like building to exactly identical race cars and handing the wheel of one car over to someone like Jimmie Johnson and having him race the average person off the street.

Both cars have the ability to do great things, now it's just down to the operator and their skill, ability and experience.

For someone to say one of the race cars wasn't very good because it didn't win would be an over-generalization, kind of like saying the Consumer Line can't produce great results when it can when used following the basics,

1. Evaluate the condition of the finish
2. Choose the right product
3. Use good technique

[Mike Phillips]

Re: The Junkman not likeing Meguiar's consumer products?

I've watched most of Junkman's videos and he does a good job of getting an idea across to help others be successful in their garage and that's always been my goal whether here on MOL or AG or any forum.

Do your best to make sure your how-to information can be taken out into the garage by someone else and they can be successful working on their car.

As for Meguiar's Consumer products, after years of watching forum members on another popular forum diss Meguiar's Consumer Line simply because it was OTC, that is Over the Counter, I took great joy in using the Deep Crystal Line plus some M16 as a topper on this classic car, all done by hand and then cashing the $800.00 check for one day's worth of work using about $30.00 worth of good old, over the counter, Consumer products.



Before









We snapped a couple shots of the trunk while the sun was at the right angle to capture a before and after shot of the paint condition.








Quote:

Originally Posted by BlueLibby04 How did you get the swirls out of that paint Mike?

By hand using Deep Crystal Paint Cleaner followed by the Deep Crystal System and topped with M16. I have a thread on the process that I'll try to put back up after I finish adding all the photos.

[akimel]

Re: The Junkman not likeing Meguiar's consumer products?

I agree. The Junkman's videos are great. He has a passion for detailing.

I'd be curious to hear what specific products he does not like. My experience is very limited, but I could list several consumer line products that I like very much--e.g., Ultimate Compound, Ultimate Quik Detailer, Ultimate Quik Wax, ColorX, GC Trim Detailer, Quik Interior Detailer. GC Car Shampoo and NXT Car Shampoo work just fine. For the money, the only line I can think of that offers as good a value as Meguiar's is Duragloss, but it's not as easily available.

[Underdawg736]

Re: The Junkman not likeing Meguiar's consumer products?

I'm not sure, but I think he might even represent Adam's products.
A quote from a post of his on another site:

That type of relationship can often lead to somewhat biased opinions.

FWIW, I had never heard of him until today.

He is a rep for Adam's, he's on Autopia every now and again.
I really don't care if he dislikes Meg's consumer line, that line of products is for just that....the consumer (even though most of that line has made a permanent spot in our stash). It's made and marketed for the average joe who is far from the OCD type seen here and elsewhere. He's a professional detailer and would obviously go to the professional line of products of whatever company for the majority work he does.

That being said I do like watching his videos on YouTube! I might not be a fan of Adams (probably since I never tried any of their stuff) but I like the Junkman and how he goes about teaching the art of detailing!
The man definitely has the talent and the passion!

[Andy M.]

Re: The Junkman not likeing Meguiar's consumer products?

Hey Guys,

Lets remember the forum rules. He has his opinion and is entitled to it. Meguiars Online will not tolerate the bashing of anyone on our forum, or members of any other forum. What happens elsewhere on other forums is what happens there.

1. No personal attacks toward members or non-members will be tolerated.

Thanks for understanding,

Andy M.
MOL Moderator

[CharlesW]

Re: The Junkman not likeing Meguiar's consumer products?

Everyone is going to have their own experiences and opinions on different products. He also likes Adam's products which i've tried and did not care for. So it's just a matter of personal taste, and one person's trash is another person's treasure.

I'm not sure, but I think he might even represent Adam's products.
A quote from a post of his on another site:

Add to the fact that the product works and the customer service is top tier, it was a no brainer for me to join the Adam's family and show just how good the product is. Adam, who I occasionally work with side by side is one of the most outstanding individuals that I have ever met. I enjoy assisting him in promoting his product line

That type of relationship can often lead to somewhat biased opinions.

FWIW, I had never heard of him until today.

[imacarnut]

Re: The Junkman not likeing Meguiar's consumer products?

Everyone is going to have their own experiences and opinions on different products. He also likes Adam's products which i've tried and did not care for. So it's just a matter of personal taste, and one person's trash is another person's treasure.

[Tuck91]

Re: The Junkman not likeing Meguiar's consumer products?

I have gotten great results using Meguiars consumer line products.