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**travisdecpn** · Jun 24, 2005, 07:22 PM

Cleaners and dressings with ****** are pretty much a scam. ****** is only effective when it is baked on at the factory. While the concept of cleaners having a ****** additive seems great, it is nothing more than a marketing gimmick to convince people that their tires/wheels/paint will have the added protection of "******." I'm sorry I sound so negative, but it's the truth.

**travisdecpn** · Jun 24, 2005, 07:24 PM

A product like NXT, #20, and #21 all do a great job of protecting your wheels from brake dust and road debris. As for your tires, endurance is a great dressing as well as #38.

**thatchman1** · Jun 24, 2005, 07:35 PM

******

Originally posted by travisdecpn
Cleaners and dressings with ****** are pretty much a scam. ****** is only effective when it is baked on at the factory. While the concept of cleaners having a ****** additive seems great, it is nothing more than a marketing gimmick to convince people that their tires/wheels/paint will have the added protection of "******." I'm sorry I sound so negative, but it's the truth.

I understand how some might interpret your response as negative. Not a problem, I understand the ****** situation.

In this case, ****** is only a marketing term. The products I'm using contain a high lubricity synthetic polymer. I can say that it is better than untreated, and when I do trials of applying the cleaner to the rims, those rimes accumulate almost no dust over a week, while the untreated side gets a coating.

According to DuPont, they market several chemical preparations/treatments/additives that vary greatly in application & intent, but generally bring them under the "******" name because of brand recognition. They attempt to keep stuff from sticking. Yeah we certainly aren't spraying the non-stick cookware stuff from a bottle though that hard surface is what most people think of when they think of ******.

The real ****** as you said, like on a frying pan, is applied at several hundred degrees with a dissolving chemical known as C8. (it also makes for huge lawsuits when it gets into the local water table.....)

I wouldn't want to mislead anyone here either in saying what I had without dumping in all of this as well....

**Tim Lingor** · Jun 24, 2005, 07:41 PM

Hey,

Just to comment...

I would strongly advise against using products that were not designed specifically for the automobile. For example, some household cleaners may have a pH that is very deterimental to paint. Most OEM wheels as well as many after-market wheels have a clear coat finish. This finish is very durable but also easily damaged if the wrong product is used on them. And..just like clear coat on a car, the break down may not be immediately apparent. Instead, will develop into clear coat failure just like BC/CC on a car over a few months. In your case, hopefully no permenant damage has occured to the wheels. Again, I urge you to stop using a household cleaner and only use products designed for the automobile.

When tires turn brown it is called blooming. Tire manufacturers have added products to the rubber to prevent break down of the rubber due to environmental factors (ozone and UV etc...). Sometimes if a tire is thoroughly cleaned, blooming occurs more pronounced.

If you want a tire product with less shine and very durable, I would suggest using Meguiar's All Season Dressing from the Detailer Line of products.

Tim

**thatchman1** · Jun 24, 2005, 07:44 PM

new one

Well, I'm just in luck. I got a new car yesterday so I have a fresh start.

You're probably right, I probably shouldn't do that. I guess I don't always do what I should.

Thanks for the recommendations.

Chap Stik seems to work better than any other product for hiding scratches or plastic dry out in odometer lenses also, but I guess I'm just unconventional...

**TOGWT** · Jun 25, 2005, 06:10 AM

I agree with 2Hotford on household products.

A word of caution, do not be tempted to use household cleaning products for automotive cleaning as they are formulated for very different purposes and could cause damage. Avoid any products that contain bleach, ammonia or harsh detergents as they usually also contain high levels of sodium.

As for the Chapstick, you are covering/filling the micro scratches with silicone, not as unconventional as you may think
JonM

**Mosca** · Jun 25, 2005, 06:10 AM

I seem to recall reading that ****** in these types of products serves a real purpose; it increases spreadability and aids in forming a viable film.

I don't think I'd spray ANYTHING that says "Clorox" on my wheels, unless I was trying to ruin them. Bleach could harden the tires and might cause them to fail under emergency conditions. Clorox is a good product when used as directed, but it isn't for automotive finishes.

thatchman1, I haven't found that tires get so mucch dirtier than the rest of the car that a dedicated cleaner is necessary. Just wash them with regular soap and dress them when dry.

Tom

**thatchman1** · Jun 25, 2005, 06:33 AM

Originally posted by Mosca
I seem to recall reading that ****** in these types of products serves a real purpose; it increases spreadability and aids in forming a viable film.

I don't think I'd spray ANYTHING that says "Clorox" on my wheels, unless I was trying to ruin them. Bleach could harden the tires and might cause them to fail under emergency conditions. Clorox is a good product when used as directed, but it isn't for automotive finishes.

thatchman1, I haven't found that tires get so mucch dirtier than the rest of the car that a dedicated cleaner is necessary. Just wash them with regular soap and dress them when dry.

Tom

No clorox in the product, no bleach, or any other bleaching agent. Its basically bathroom sink cleaner meant for metals and painted metals of faucets and other non-porous surfaces. Again, just the marketing name. The surficant (what the call ******) does create a very similar slippery feeling to the NXT wax. Repels stuff from sticking.

I never guessed I would have generated all this flack! Lots of up tight carcare freaks here!

(that's not a bad thing). I keep my car as clean and shining as everyone else here, I guess I'm a little daring and willing to try things outside the box.... And am willing to pay if things go awry. I certainly would never try anything daring on paint. Maybe I should change my screenname to madcarscientist or something.....

**Mosca** · Jun 25, 2005, 08:49 AM

Originally posted by thatchman1
I never guessed I would have generated all this flack! Lots of up tight carcare freaks here! (that's not a bad thing). I keep my car as clean and shining as everyone else here, I guess I'm a little daring and willing to try things outside the box.... And am willing to pay if things go awry. I certainly would never try anything daring on paint. Maybe I should change my screenname to madcarscientist or something.....

Hey, no problem, it's a fun discussion! "madcarscientist"... that's kinda cool, actually!

Tom

**imacarnut** · Jun 25, 2005, 11:21 AM

Originally posted by 2hotford
I would strongly advise against using products that were not designed specifically for the automobile

**escape** · Jun 25, 2005, 02:40 PM

I guess I am quite unconventional too. When I get tar on the unpainted cladding of my Escape, I found 409 does an excellent job of removing it. Most bug/tar products stain the cladding, but 409 seems to remove it without damage. I do top it with Trim Detailer after use. I have also found that 409 is great for cleaning wheels. I apply it, scrub it in and rinse off. Then wash with NXT and dry. I have experienced no ill-effects from doing this. I wouldn't want anyone trying this if they didn't agree, but it seems to work for me.

**RamAirV1** · Jun 25, 2005, 03:27 PM

Originally posted by 2hotford

When tires turn brown it is called blooming. Tire manufacturers have added products to the rubber to prevent break down of the rubber due to environmental factors (ozone and UV etc...). Sometimes if a tire is thoroughly cleaned, blooming occurs more pronounced.

That confirms my theory of why my tires turn brown just after an intensive cleaning. I agree with Mosca about the need to intensively clean tires on a regular basis. Every month or two might be a good idea. The cleaning I did using the NXT Tire Cleaner did seem to boost the durability of the Insane Shine I applied afterwards.

If you want a tire product with less shine and very durable, I would suggest using Meguiar's All Season Dressing from the Detailer Line of products.

Tim

Would the #38 from the pro line also have less shine and be durable? It may be easier to find in some areas. I cannot get any detailer products locally, they haven't even heard of them here. I like the extreme shine myself and, much to my surprise, the Insane Shine is easy to find. Even Walmart has it!

RamAirV1

**RamAirV1** · Jul 11, 2005, 02:55 PM

Originally posted by escape
I guess I am quite unconventional too. When I get tar on the unpainted cladding of my Escape, I found 409 does an excellent job of removing it. Most bug/tar products stain the cladding, but 409 seems to remove it without damage. I do top it with Trim Detailer after use. I have also found that 409 is great for cleaning wheels. I apply it, scrub it in and rinse off. Then wash with NXT and dry. I have experienced no ill-effects from doing this. I wouldn't want anyone trying this if they didn't agree, but it seems to work for me.

What is the unpainted cladding made out of? Rubber? Plastic?

I ask this because I have some tar removal to do and am trying to avoid any pitfalls.

How does WD-40 work for tar removal? Has anyone here tried it?

RamAirV1

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