Do we need a Meguiar's paintwork "cleanser"?

[Tim Lingor]

Re: Do we need a Meguiar's paintwork "cleanser"?

Would a "cleanser" be like Poorboy's Black Hole? Still have a new bottle of this, just no time to use it.

Hey Tyler,

I do not know as I have not use that product before.

However, I have used a lot of the Medallion Paint Cleaner and it was an awesome product! The only complaint I had was that using it in a closed environment made you loopy from the chemical smell! But man...did it work!


Tim

[Markus Kleis]

Re: Do we need a Meguiar's paintwork "cleanser"?

I just want to chime in here for a second and remind everyone that although we certainly allow and encourage discussion of products and technique on MOL, we condone confrontational tones or words.

As Mike Phillips used to point out, few topics will draw more passionate responses (and arguments) than car wax and religion.

Feel free to share your opinion, but please avoid confrontational posting and posting information as if it is fact, when it is more of a personal opinion.

There is a lot of misinformation on the internet, and a lot of it gets started from drawing conclusions based on too little information.

Thanks in advance.

Mark

[Bounty]

Re: Do we need a Meguiar's paintwork "cleanser"?

Secondly, Meguiar's did have a paint cleanser of sorts, in its discontinued Medallion Line. In the consumer line, Meguiar's also had Body Scrub which was mostly a strong chemical cleaner. I still have bottles of each of these as they work so darn well, especially removal of water etchings/spots.

Dangit Tim! Is that you that keeps out bidding me on those bottles on Ebay?! If you ever want to let go of a bottle of MPC or BS let me know...

Thirdly, the specialized cleaners in Meguiar's NXT 2.0 will not remove all of the previous layer. The specialized cleaners are used in it as well as M21 as a means to aiding in the bonding process.

Yup, I too remember the pages and pages of discussion on Autopia and Autogeek debating whether or not NXT contained cleaners until Meguiar's finally came out and put the discussion to rest by divulging the cleaning agents within NXT.

[Tim Lingor]

Re: Do we need a Meguiar's paintwork "cleanser"?

Dangit Tim! Is that you that keeps out bidding me on those bottles on Ebay?! If you ever want to let go of a bottle of MPC or BS let me know...



Yup, I too remember the pages and pages of discussion on Autopia and Autogeek debating whether or not NXT contained cleaners until Meguiar's finally came out and put the discussion to rest by divulging the cleaning agents within NXT.

LOLOL Nope...my Medallion is staying with me until the end!

Oh I remember those arguments as I was part of many of them. (I was one of the original Lab Sample E testers while at the same time moderating AOPP, SCG and then MOL.) The difficult part is that due to trade secrets etc, the ingredients that are present and what they are really being used for are not known to the public, which ends up leading to speculation and often, incorrect conclusions. That is the real value of MOL as it helps to correct misinformation in regards to Meguiar's products!


Tim

[akimel]

Re: Do we need a Meguiar's paintwork "cleanser"?

If the responses so far are representative, I think it is accurate to say that little demand exists for the kind of paint cleanser that I described in my original article. As as been pointed out, the functions offered by a cleanser can be achieved by various combinations of Meguiar's products. If one wants to clean the paint, e.g., one can always use an abrasive cleaner/polish (M09, SwirlX, etc.) or a cleaner wax (ColorX, Cleaner Wax, M20, etc.). If one wants to clean the paint and add a little gloss, then one can follow-up the cleaner/polish with a pure polish (DC2, M07, M81). I suppose one might also follow-up a cleaner wax with a pure polish, and maybe this works very well in reality--I know some MOL members love the results they have gotten--but I confess that applying a pure polish on top of a wax just strikes me as ... well, "unseemly." Once I have waxed a car, the only thing I want to put on top of the wax is another coat of wax. In any case, following up either a cleaner/polish or a cleaner wax with a pure polish requires a two-step process rather than just one.

M09 might seem to fulfill the qualifications of what I have described as a paint cleanser, though it's unclear to me how effectively it cleans paint when applied by hand. Its cleaning action is effected by diminishing abrasives, and these abrasives still need to be broken down--and that takes work, right? Paint cleansers, on the other hand, appear to accomplish their objectives more easily: you rub them on and wipe them off, just like one would apply and remove a pure polish.

But if there is no demand for a paint cleanser, and apparently there is not, then it would be silly for Meguiar's to entertain the creation of such a product.

I guess it's time to talk about ... boutique waxes.

Cheers,
Al

[Murr1525]

Re: Do we need a Meguiar's paintwork "cleanser"?

Even DC1 had diminishing abrasives...

[jmakado]

Re: Do we need a Meguiar's paintwork "cleanser"?

Just to chime in here...

Tim

Yeah, we are all saying the same thing.....

[EagleNester]

Re: Do we need a Meguiar's paintwork "cleanser"?

Reviving an old thread here... But the subject is one I'm currently dealing with. To my knowledge, the OPs question is still valid. I'd like a product that will remove any traces of last spring's ULW/Collinite before I reapply ULW for the winter. After claying, which certainly won't entirely remove previously applied wax/sealant, what product would one use as a paint cleanser to prep the surface for a new coat of sealant? Key here is that I'm working by hand. I really don't want to use a cleaner wax topped with a sealant. So cleaner wax is not an option (i.e. "Don't top wax with a sealer").

[davey g-force]

Re: Do we need a Meguiar's paintwork "cleanser"?

You could use IPA (isopropyl alcohol) diluted with water.

Alternatively, you could use a product like CarPro Eraser.

[EagleNester]

Re: Do we need a Meguiar's paintwork "cleanser"?

You could use IPA (isopropyl alcohol) diluted with water.

Alternatively, you could use a product like CarPro Eraser.

Can you comment on any of these others?
-pinnacle/Wolfgang cleansing lotion
-four star pre-wax cleanser
-P21S

i'd like one that will not soften the clear coat. I've read that some of the pre wax cleansers temporarily/chemically soften the clear so it self-levels.

[DasBurninator]

Re: Do we need a Meguiar's paintwork "cleanser"?

Can you comment on any of these others?
-pinnacle/Wolfgang cleansing lotion
-four star pre-wax cleanser
-P21S

i'd like one that will not soften the clear coat. I've read that some of the pre wax cleansers temporarily/chemically soften the clear so it self-levels.

I can comment on the Pinnacle cleansing lotion. Not sure if it softens the clear coat, but it does work for cleaning up polishing oils, etc prior to applying a coating.

Personally I have been using a bit of D114 mixed with IPA and water as my wipedown prior to applying coatings, but I don't feel that is strong enough to remove some sealants. Just polishing oils.

If it was me I would probably polish with Megs Ultimate Polish or M205 to start with a clean slate. Claying will probably remove left over sealant as well. I have heard of people removing coatings by being too aggressive with them.

[davey g-force]

Re: Do we need a Meguiar's paintwork "cleanser"?

Can you comment on any of these others?
-pinnacle/Wolfgang cleansing lotion
-four star pre-wax cleanser
-P21S

i'd like one that will not soften the clear coat. I've read that some of the pre wax cleansers temporarily/chemically soften the clear so it self-levels.

No sorry, I haven't used any of those.

[The Guz]

Re: Do we need a Meguiar's paintwork "cleanser"?

I can comment on the Pinnacle cleansing lotion. Not sure if it softens the clear coat, but it does work for cleaning up polishing oils, etc prior to applying a coating.

Personally I have been using a bit of D114 mixed with IPA and water as my wipedown prior to applying coatings, but I don't feel that is strong enough to remove some sealants. Just polishing oils.

If it was me I would probably polish with Megs Ultimate Polish or M205 to start with a clean slate. Claying will probably remove left over sealant as well. I have heard of people removing coatings by being too aggressive with them.

I would have to agree with this. Too add more to this.

Mike Phillips answered your question over on AGO. But seeing as you have UP, you can use that as a "paint cleanser". If I recall correctly you are doing things by hand so there is no need to worry about UP or M205 softening your clear coat. UP and M205 are mechanically cleansing the paint with the SMAT abrasives. You will know when you have cleaned the area by having the squeaky feeling when applying and removing the product.

Pinnacle, Four Star, Wolfgang and Blackfire use non-abrasives. Good if the paint is in great shape with little to no defects.

As Mike Phillips stated you use one or the other but not both.

Good point on D114. It can be diluted strong enough to strip a wax.

[EagleNester]

Re: Do we need a Meguiar's paintwork "cleanser"?

I would have to agree with this. Too add more to this.

Mike Phillips answered your question over on AGO. But seeing as you have UP, you can use that as a "paint cleanser". If I recall correctly you are doing things by hand so there is no need to worry about UP or M205 softening your clear coat. UP and M205 are mechanically cleansing the paint with the SMAT abrasives. You will know when you have cleaned the area by having the squeaky feeling when applying and removing the product.

Pinnacle, Four Star, Wolfgang and Blackfire use non-abrasives. Good if the paint is in great shape with little to no defects.

As Mike Phillips stated you use one or the other but not both.

Good point on D114. It can be diluted strong enough to strip a wax.

Yup, Mike set me straight. Thanks for all the help, guys. basically, NONE of the products chemically soften paint any longer to level it. So, any of today's non-abrasive chemical paint cleansers will work for me. It's an effective process, but we now have better means of accomplishing that goal. That's what I was wanting to confirm, as I wasn't confident that I was getting much cleaning ability from the UP with an application by hand.

[EagleNester]

Re: Do we need a Meguiar's paintwork "cleanser"?

It looks to me like the Mirror Bright line of products in 2016 will have a product that fits this bill. A "cleaner sealer". Compatible with a ULW top coat.