Questions after my first try with rotary.

[AZStang]

After a couple days of practicing on my junk yard panels, I finally began work on "restoring" the paint on my truck and I have a few questions. I'm working on a 1996 F series with the original clear coat paint. I'm using a DW849 rotary and a G100 along with D151 Paint Reconditioning Cream and 6.5" Meguiar's foam polishing and cutting pads. No wool pad - yet. I've been using the foam cutting pad with the D151 on the rotary at 1,800 rpm. Buffing an area 4-5 times with moderate pressure applied seems to produces pretty good results. I would say 90-95% of the swirls are gone and the RDS are greatly minimized.

Now the questions.

1. What would be the next step up in aggressiveness from this point? I have to apply fresh product to the same area many times to get the swirls out. It's working, but is very time consuming and I'm going through a lot of product. I see my options as turning the rotary speed up a little more, switching to a wool pad, or switching to a more aggressive product.

2. After using the rotary at 1,800 rpm with the foam cutting pad and D151 the finish looks very good without any buffer trails or holograms. I have followed this with the G100 using a polishing pad and the D151, but it doesn't seem to have any affect on improving the finish further. Not that I'm complaining, but from all that I've read here it doesn't seem possible that I should have a near perfect finish after "cutting" with a rotary. At least not as a beginner. Any ideas?

Thanks,
Shawn

[Maserati Mario]

Re: Questions after my first try with rotary.

Pics would help
I would have started with M105 and a wool pad
But it sounds like your happy with the results?
If you post pics we can help out more.

[Mike Phillips]

Re: Questions after my first try with rotary.

Buffing an area 4-5 times with moderate pressure applied seems to produces pretty good results. I would say 90-95% of the swirls are gone and the RDS are greatly minimized.

Now the questions.

1. What would be the next step up in aggressiveness from this point?

You're using a cleaner/wax when it sounds like you should be using a compound.

Get a quart of M105 and try this out, it's easy to use and a lot more effective than using a cleaner/wax for removing swirls and scratches. You can use it with just about any pad combination but for the most aggressive cutting action use it with a wool pad. For less aggressive cutting action use it with one of our yellow foam polishing pads.

Then use it with the DA to insure no swirls and after that you should be able to go to wax or maybe get some M205 and do another step to bring the finish results to an even higher level.

Pretty hard to beat the M105/M205 Tag Team by rotary buffer or DA Polisher and then apply your favorite LSP

[AeroCleanse]

Re: Questions after my first try with rotary.

I would use D151 with a wool pad if you are happy with D151. If that doesn't work well enough, then try M105.

[Mike Phillips]

Re: Questions after my first try with rotary.

I would use D151 with a wool pad if you are happy with D151. If that doesn't work well enough, then try M105.

That will make for a more aggressive combination but again, he's using a cleaner/wax to try to do serious paint correction and if the goal is to learn the way of the rotary buffer then sooner or later he's going to want/need to test out a dedicated products just for the learning experience to really see what a rotary buffer is capable of.

[Mike Phillips]

Re: Questions after my first try with rotary.

Not that I'm complaining, but from all that I've read here it doesn't seem possible that I should have a near perfect finish after "cutting" with a rotary. At least not as a beginner. Any ideas?

If I'm reading this right, you're surprised that the paint looks so good after using D151 with a rotary?

If that's the case that's in part because of the SMAT and in part because it's also polishing and leaving a wax behind at the same time it's cutting.

[AZStang]

Re: Questions after my first try with rotary.

Thanks for the reply's guys.

You're using a cleaner/wax when it sounds like you should be using a compound.

Get a quart of M105 and try this out, it's easy to use and a lot more effective than using a cleaner/wax for removing swirls and scratches. You can use it with just about any pad combination but for the most aggressive cutting action use it with a wool pad. For less aggressive cutting action use it with one of our yellow foam polishing pads.

Then use it with the DA to insure no swirls and after that you should be able to go to wax or maybe get some M205 and do another step to bring the finish results to an even higher level.

Pretty hard to beat the M105/M205 Tag Team by rotary buffer or DA Polisher and then apply your favorite LSP

I do have some 105 and 205, but I have not tried them on the truck yet. I did try the 105 on my salvage yard hood, but it seemed to dry up way too fast. I was using the rotary set to 1,400 rpm with a foam polishing pad. I would spread the product out in about a 12" x 12" square then go back to work it but it would already be dry. The D151 doesn't seem to dry up as fast. Temps here in the desert are in the low 80's with near zero humidity and a light breeze blowing. The dew point is actually at 6°F currently. I am working under a carport in the shade too. I used the 105 by hand on the door handle pockets with great results. Maybe I need to speed it up to ±1,800 rpm or so?

Anyway, my test spot was performed on the hood and I did that with the rotary set at 1,4000 with a foam polishing pad and the D151. That combination worked really well on the hood and the roof and removed all the defects. It was when I tried to correct the sides that it became much more difficult to achieve the same results. This is when I switched to the foam cutting pad.

If I'm reading this right, you're surprised that the paint looks so good after using D151 with a rotary?

If that's the case that's in part because of the SMAT and in part because it's also polishing and leaving a wax behind at the same time it's cutting.

I'm not necessarily surprised that the paint looks good after using D151 on a cutting pad with a rotary. I'm more surprised that there are no holograms or buffer trails to clean up. From all that I've read it doesn't seem like D151 on a cutting pad with a rotary at 1,800 rpm should be my last step. What is SMAT?

Alright, here are some pics and I'll give a little background on the truck. It's a 1996 F350 Roll-A-Long. It was a factory conversion by the Roll-A-Long company in CA and was sold new from a dealer in NV with all the aftermarket items installed from day one. The graphics are painted on with a clear coat over them. They didn't clear the whole truck, just the graphics so there is a noticeable paint line where the tape was. It also had painted on pin stripes on top of the clear from day one that were in pretty poor condition. I removed most of them with the cutting pad and what was left came off with lacquer thinner. The color has faded noticeably since new so the pin stripes are still there just a darker green color now. Kind of cool I think.

Thus far I have only attempted correction from the roof down to the graphics. I have not done anything with the graphics or with the bed yet other than a test spot to see how the graphics paint compared to the rest of the truck. Seems to be about the same.



I didn't take any before pics, but here is shot of the untouched bed.


Some after shots.






One showing some of the ghost pin stripes.


A couple areas that could use more work.




So, I guess the answer is to try M105. I don't have a wool pad, so I'll start with the foam polishing and then try the foam cutting if I need to. If that doesn't work, I guess I'll need to get a wool pad. Then clean that up with M205 on the rotary or G100?

Thanks again,
Shawn

[AeroCleanse]

Re: Questions after my first try with rotary.

I would (personally) use D151 on a wool pad followed up with D151 on a foam pad.

[Mike Phillips]

Re: Questions after my first try with rotary.

I'm not necessarily surprised that the paint looks good after using D151 on a cutting pad with a rotary. I'm more surprised that there are no holograms or buffer trails to clean up.

From all that I've read it doesn't seem like D151 on a cutting pad with a rotary at 1,800 rpm should be my last step.

If there are swirls, and there probably are since you used a cutting pad with a rotary, then the wax being left behind is likely filling or masking them.

If you're happy with the finished resulst don't worry about it and just keep a coat of wax on the paint all the time.

What is SMAT?

From our Hot Topics forum,

What's the difference between Meguiar's Super Micro Abrasive technology and Meguiar's Diminishing Abrasive technology?

[AZStang]

Re: Questions after my first try with rotary.

Thanks Mike.

The biggest problem I have with the M105 is that it dries on the paint instantly after spreading it out. You say to never work a product until it's dry. Does that mean don't work the product till the pad is dry, but dried product on the paint it okay? Or don't work it beyond any part of it drying out? In my instance, the pad of course still has wet product on it, but the product on the paint dries instantly.

I have noticed with the D151, that it seems to "play" longer at higher speeds (>1,600). I only tried the M105 at lower speeds. Maybe turning it up will help some.

I know to keep the work area small and clean the pad often and have been doing that. Any other ideas on how to keep M105 from drying out so fast?

Thanks,
Shawn

[IMSHAKN]

Re: Questions after my first try with rotary.

Out here in AZ I too often struggle with working time of some of the Meguiar's products, but I've found that a little quick detailer on the pad is usually just enough additional lubrication to work a small area.

[AZStang]

Re: Questions after my first try with rotary.

Out here in AZ I too often struggle with working time of some of the Meguiar's products, but I've found that a little quick detailer on the pad is usually just enough additional lubrication to work a small area.

Thanks for the tip, I'll give that a try. I tried a little water when I was practicing on my salvage yard hood, but it must have been too much because it splattered everywhere.

I did a small test spot on the bed with the M105 a couple weeks ago with much better results. After one pass using the rotary at 1,800 rpm with a Meguiar's foam polishing pad I thought it was perfect under the lights. Looked at in the sun the next day and there were still some light swirls, so I'm going to try it again with the foam cutting pad next when I get a chance.

Oh and from one new guy to another, welcome to the site.

Shawn