Ahh.....rotary help....I dont know whats wrong...

[johnny--2k]

OK, So I've been using rotaries for a long time at dealerships etc....

Well, I finally bought one, used it on my TL with some show car glaze, and it created a lot of buffer trails/holograms that only showed up after I washed the car. I got them out using my buddies DA and some #80, then did two coats of NXT by hand, turned out great!!

So, bought a new pad from our dealerships supplier along with the wax I have used at the dealerships for a long time called Very Cherry. It's a mild cleaner plus carnuba and works wonders on every car i've done.

Anyways, I tried a small spot on my buddies car and he called me the next day and said he had some swirls a buffer trails as well in the spot we did.

I'm not doing anything different than before, and it just doesnt seem to come out right. Only using it on speeds of 2 - 2.5 max.

Any ideas?

TIA,
John

[Meguiar's Car Maniac]

Actually I would have asked this to your supplier or manufacturer of Very Cherry...
Don't know about Very Cherry here in Belgium, sounds more like a name for candy or bubble gum?

Buffer swirls, holograms are caused by a combination of things like compounds with sharp mechanical abrasive that do not break down, not working the product long enough or too long, buffing pads like synthetic wool pads inflicting their own scratches, poor technique, too much product or too little product, wrong angle,...

Try Meguiar's M83 Dual Action Cleaner Polish or M-66 Quick Detailer with a yellow polishing pad w8000.
Set the speed around 1700-1800 rpm and keep your pad flat on the surface

Hope this helps

[Erik Mejia]

IMHO, I would not use a rotary to apply a wax, secondly you should try following your rotary work with a g100 and a less agressive product to remove those buffer trails. seems to that you hadn't encountered this problem at work because the products you may have been using were covering up/filling in the trails, or you just hadn't really taken the time to notice them before. good luck to you

[Mike Phillips]

In most cases, for most people, if the last process performed to the paint was through the use of a rotary buffer then chances are very good you're going to instill and leave behind holograms or rotary buffer swirls.

This has to do with the direct contact of the rotating pad with some combination of pad, product and pressure against the finish.

If possible, make you last machine process the dual action polisher to insure you've removed any swirls induced by the rotary buffer.

I think the topic is dealt with thoroughly in these two threads...

Need Help! - How to Avoid Holograms?

How to Avoid Swirls and Holograms?

[jchetty]

Re: Ahh.....rotary help....I dont know whats wrong...

Originally posted by johnny--2k
OK, So I've been using rotaries for a long time at dealerships etc....

Well, I finally bought one, used it on my TL with some show car glaze, and it created a lot of buffer trails/holograms that only showed up after I washed the car. I got them out using my buddies DA and some #80, then did two coats of NXT by hand, turned out great!!

So, bought a new pad from our dealerships supplier along with the wax I have used at the dealerships for a long time called Very Cherry. It's a mild cleaner plus carnuba and works wonders on every car i've done.

Anyways, I tried a small spot on my buddies car and he called me the next day and said he had some swirls a buffer trails as well in the spot we did.

I'm not doing anything different than before, and it just doesnt seem to come out right. Only using it on speeds of 2 - 2.5 max.

Any ideas?

TIA,
John

yeah the pad can definately do it, esp if its not clean..have a a brush with medium stiff bristles so u can brush out the pad, i do it after each panel...also you speed might be the problems..i find that for cleaning/wax on step 1000to 1500 rpms is max and that you for compounding i never ever step up to over 2000rpms max..i personally dont go over 1300rpms max, havent had to yet, i change product and pad b4 speed........depending on your rotary, if 2 to 2.5 is 2000 rpms to 2500 rpms its is way to fast of a speed imo

[tumbler]

rotary hologramming is quite normal.. I get 'em all the time. Its reality. I always have my PC on hand to go over and rid them with a softer compound. So what most people think is that a rotary itself is good enough. In my view, a rotary followed up with a pc is the perfect combo.

[johnny--2k]

Wow!

Thanks for all the info. As for the pad being dirty, it's brand new. Too little product may have been one problem since the pad was new.

It's just wierd that the holograms dont show up until after the car has been washed! Thats the strangest part of it all. After I'm done with the car, it looks great. Then if it gets washed, it looks like ****.

Well, looks like I'll have to figure something else out for the rotary use and just keep waxing by hand instead!

[Mike Phillips]

Well without getting deep...

Anytime you touch the paint, the potential exists to instill a swirl or scratch. Your job and my job is to reduce the potential.

When you bring a pad spinning at anywhere from 1000 rpm to 1500 rpm and you touch the paint with it, the potential exists to instill a swirl or scratch, or hologram.

Chances are pretty good that when a pad is touch the finish under pressure and spinning at a rapid speed, that you're instilling swirls. You are also likely removing defects so you're trading one defect for another defects. After you have removed the defects that you didn't want in the paint to start with, then all you have to do is remove the by-product of the process swirls and this is where the dual action polisher comes in.

By re-polishing the paint using a tool that touches the paint in a different manner, in most cases you can remove the swirls or holograms and with any luck not leave any micro-marring in the finish.

Using the right product, the right pad and the right technique for all your procedures is vitally important to product a show car, swirl-free, micro-mar free finish.

You might want to read what I wrote in a rather lengthy reply on page three of this thread..., (Which I just moved into the Hot Topics forum).

http://meguiarsonline.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=12056