G100 Advice

[BlackFirebird LS1]

I have visited this forum, but this is my first post. I have used many of Meguiar's hand applied products, and to pretty good sucess (better than anything I can find!). They make a great difference. But I am ready to take the next step so I can tackle the swirl marks on my black 2000 Pontiac Firebird Formula, which have been very stuborn up to this point. I also want to speed up the application of the products so that I can get more done. So on to my question:

I am thinking about ordering the G-100A, but have a couple of concerns before I do. Is it really as safe as everyone says for the paint? I really dont want to mess anything up, especially my paint.

Also, what products should I purchase along with the polisher? I currently have Deep Crystal Paint Cleaner, Deep Crystal Polish, and Gold class liquid wax, along with a clay bar and Gold class soap for washing. Can DC Cleaner, DC Polish, and GC liquid wax be applied with a dual action polisher? If so, where do both Deep Crystal products rate on the agressiveness scale? I also have scratch X, but I understand this should not be applied with a Dual Action Polisher. What is a good alternative to this? Any other good product recomendations would be very appreciated, and any advice would also be welcomed. Thanks!

Mike

[black240sx]

Deep Crystal Paint Cleaner is mild. You likely won't remove any swirls with it. The popular products for removing swirls with the G100 are M83 Dual-Action Cleaner Polish, and M80 Speed Glaze. M80 is the milder of the two, and may or may not do the job for you.

[scrub]

Re: G100 Advice

Hi there and welcome. You started out with some good questions.

Originally posted by BlackFirebird LS1
I have visited this forum, but this is my first post. I have used many of Meguiar's hand applied products, and to pretty good sucess (better than anything I can find!). They make a great difference. But I am ready to take the next step so I can tackle the swirl marks on my black 2000 Pontiac Firebird Formula, which have been very stuborn up to this point. I also want to speed up the application of the products so that I can get more done. So on to my question:

The G-100 is the answer to speed up the process and get the maximum results with the products. There are some limits to what the G-100 can do. That's the price of safety.

Originally posted by BlackFirebird LS1
I am thinking about ordering the G-100A, but have a couple of concerns before I do. Is it really as safe as everyone says for the paint? I really dont want to mess anything up, especially my paint.

With the proper pad, product, technique then yes the G-100 is very safe and can perform minor defect correction. If any of the above (proper pad, product, or technique) is not followed there is an increased chance for damage. That holds true for products applied by hand too. 1999 Corvette - Remove Swirls and Scratches. Take a look and see the damage done by hand application of the wrong product.

I was reluctant to purchase the G-100 I waited over a year to buy one. Now that I have one I don't know how I polished and waxed without one.

Do some searches and see the results. Yes the G-100 has limitations but the improvement outweighs the limitations.

Originally posted by BlackFirebird LS1
Also, what products should I purchase along with the polisher? I currently have Deep Crystal Paint Cleaner, Deep Crystal Polish, and Gold class liquid wax, along with a clay bar and Gold class soap for washing. Can DC Cleaner, DC Polish, and GC liquid wax be applied with a dual action polisher?

That's a good start. Keep those products for use in between machine polishing. I'll also add the DC products can also be applied by machine. When I said machine polish I meant surface correction. I don't and most don't perform surface correction polishing every time we wax a car. That's where the DC products will step in and give the paint a nice shine before waxing.

Originally posted by BlackFirebird LS1
If so, where do both Deep Crystal products rate on the agressiveness scale?

The don't rate very high if at all. If you notice some swirl/defect removal with the DC line it's more of a by product of the pad being used rather than the product.

Originally posted by BlackFirebird LS1
I also have scratch X, but I understand this should not be applied with a Dual Action Polisher.

Correct. I haven't tried that. I've heard the product gets real gummy. Some have tried with good results. There again it goes back to safety and the proper pads, products, and techniques.

Originally posted by BlackFirebird LS1
What is a good alternative to this? Any other good product recomendations would be very appreciated, and any advice would also be welcomed. Thanks!

Mike

I use


#80 Speed Glaze

as my go to product with great results. Sometimes I might have to perform 2 applications to get the desired results but that's OK too.

Another product to look at is


#83 Body Shop Professional Dual Action Cleaner/Polish

This does a good job removing what the #80 can't. Like I said before there are limitations with the G-100. Some defects can't be removed unless a rotary is used. The #83 does take a little bit of time to break down properly. When finished with #83 more times than not the paint is ready for LSP (wax). If marring is left behind from the #83 then step down to #80 or any finer polish to remove the haze.

If you have time and feel up to it then bust out the DC polish and the top with the GC. WOW. You'll be impressed.

This post encompasses almost all I have learned about the G-100 over the past year. Good luck and PM me for product sample details.

[BlackFirebird LS1]

Thanks for all the help so far!

I went ahead and washed my car today, and snapped some pictures in very bright sun light to show everyone the swirl marks. Do you think these can be gotten out with a DA polisher and the above products?

(Ignore the white gashes in the paint below, I know I am going to need to get those fixed at a body shop )






It doesnt look quite as bad in real life, especially in normal conditions, but the pictures show you what it looks like in bright sunlight. So what do the pro's think?

[travisdecpn]

I'd try the G-100 and some #83 DACP and a W-8006 on those, it's going to take some time, but they can be removed. Don't be afraid of the G-100, it is almost a perfect balance between power and safety, even in the hands of a novice there is little fear of damaging your paint.

A few tips on purchase and use would be to get some #83, #80, the DAV-99 kit, and take your time. You should work in 2x2 foot sections and inspect your work as you go. A good wash and clay go a long way in your polishing steps; a smooth surface is a lot more conducive to polishing than one covered in contaminants. Finally, just have some fun, take your time and make it enjoyable, it's a great form of therapy. Hope this helps.

[RamAirV1]

Nice ride! I had a black 2001 TA WS6, on which the fiberglass hood scratched very easily. There is nothing like black on a TA . I love my GTO, but I still miss the TA which does have it beat in the looks department. OTOH I like the sleeper look too.

You will probably need #83 to remove all of those swirls. A G-100 is mandatory for your car, trust me. And it is foolproof too! Some alternatives that may get most of the swirls out are Medallion Premium Paint Cleaner, used with the G-100. It is surprising what that combination can do, and it will take less time than the #83 if it works. Still another possibility is the new reformulated #2, which is now recommended for use by G-100. On a black TA, I would definitely follow the #2 or #83 with a polish like #81 or #80. Then I would finish up with NXT Tech Wax. You can apply the liquid version with the G-100. Get some Ultimate Bonnets to remove the wax with the G-100. That combination will not scratch the paint. If it doesn't scratch the Ram Air hood on a TA, it won't scratch anything!

Scratch X will take way too long for the surface are you are working on.

Be sure and post pics when you're done.


To the TA/Firebird, cars with attitude!


RamAirV1

[scrub]

Agree with everything posted above.

Wash
Clay
Test a section with MPPC (sleeper product, and discontinued)
Test a section with what ever polish you end up with. I'd start #80 then move up to #83. As I said try a test section. My feeling is even with 2 applications #80 is faster to use than #83.
If #83 is selected and haze is noticed then step down to #80 or #82.
Then top with your favorite LSP (wax).

Now for the pics. Thanks for taking the time to upload them.

1. You have your work cut out for you.
2. The final results WILL be stunning!

The pics show me cob webbing not necessarily buffer swirls (holograms). Has the car been through an automatic (friction/brush type) car wash?

Depending on the firmness of the paint polishing should be a okay. If the paint is firm then the results will be good but limited.

Good luck and bring on the after pics!

[BlackFirebird LS1]

Thanks for all the help so far! Just a few more questions, and I will be set to order (I cant wait)!
travisdecpn: What exactly is the DAV-99 kit?
RamAirV1: Yeah, I love my Formula, and my black paint, but it is a pain to take care of. Thanks for the advice!
scrub (and anyone else ): Let me make sure I got all of this right:

Wash with GC wash, dry, and clay the whole car. Then I split my hood in half with some blue painters tape, like I see in all the extreme makeover pictures, and on one side, try the MPPC applied with the G100, and remove with an Ultimate Wipe (or the Ultimate Bonnet?), and on the other side, do 2 coats of #80 Speed Glaze with the G100, removed like above.

If the #80 wasnt enough, I put a coat of #83 on top of the two coats of #80 with the G100, and remove like above.

If that leaves any haze behind, do another coat of #80 to clear it up.

Then I compare.

Which ever is better, I go over with on the whole hood (both sides) again, and then do the rest of the car. Then I put a coat of NXT on with the G100. Did I get this right? Its a lot to take in lol, so thanks for being so patient!

Edit: Also, what do I use for other cars, that maybe dont have and micro-scratches like mine, but that I want to have a great shine?

[travisdecpn]

WDAV99-B kit is a kit that includes 2 W-8006 pads and a W-9006 pad for like 25 bucks, it's a really good deal from Meguiar's site. Guess it would have helped to give you the right number.

[scrub]

You're getting close.

"Wash with GC wash, dry, and clay the whole car. Then I split my hood in half with some blue painters tape, like I see in all the extreme makeover pictures, and on one side, try the MPPC applied with the G100, and remove with an Ultimate Wipe (or the Ultimate Bonnet?), and on the other side, do 2 coats of #80 Speed Glaze with the G100, removed like above. "

This process will be time consuming. Not polishing but evaluating what polish is required. Gather the facts first then polish the rest of the vehicle. With that said here we go...

I agree with the painter tape. I would quarter the hood.

Section A: MPPC
Section B: #80

Compare the two in different lighting

If not happy with results
Section C:#80 twice
Inspect
If not right then
Section D: #83
Inspect. If hazed then try #80.
Inspect.

Determine which product gives you the desired results and move on to the rest of the car. My guess would be #80 will accomplish alot of work, but keep an open mind about it. Don't just take my word for it. As travisdecpn said this work is therapeutic.

I use the Ultimate wipe to remove polishes and save the bonnets for wax removal. Quicker not having to change pads and bonnets all the time.

"If the #80 wasn't enough, I put a coat of #83 on top of the two coats of #80 with the G100, and remove like above.

If that leaves any haze behind, do another coat of #80 to clear it up.

Then I compare."

The polish order was covered above if you choose to use my approach.

For #83 and haze then try #80.

"Which ever is better, I go over with on the whole hood (both sides) again, and then do the rest of the car. Then I put a coat of NXT on with the G100. Did I get this right? Its a lot to take in lol, so thanks for being so patient!"

Yep. Be sure to heed the advice of travisdecpn. Work small sections 2x2. Working an area too big will reduce the effectiveness of the polish. So when I work half a panel (to big of an area) and get no change it's my fault. The polish was spread to thin and the friction wasn't held in place long enough to get the focused work (abrasive breakdown) out of the product. Another thing about abrasives, they will only last so long before the product turns to polish. That's another reason to work a small area. If I focus on a smaller area I will instantly get better results. So work a small area.

If you find the polish was difficult to remove then the polish might not have been worked in enough. Take a look at this thread.
Using #83 and #80, and getting your G100/PC to do the work of a rotary. Please observe the pictures of what the Polish will look like in different stages. Very good thread and very important.

For other cars... You mean for money from clients? Depends on the condition and firmness of the paint.

Good luck.

[BlackFirebird LS1]

Thanks for the quick replies, this is by far the most helpful forum I have ever belonged to! Anyways, I will order soon and do what you suggested above.

Scrub, as for other cars, I am not goint to do a buisness or anything, or charge anything either, just family and friend's cars. I already have a friend that wants me to clay and get a good layer of polish and wax with the Dual Action polisher onto his green Dodge Caravan, and I said that I would be happy to as long as he was there to help (so he could learn to do it himself if he ever wanted to). I would also like to clean my mother's 99 Buick Century, which is a beige color, inside and out, because it really needs it. Lastly, I would like to clean my old car, which my sister now drives, a green 2000 Chevy Malibu. It definatly needs some help in some areas. But im not planning on doing a buisness or anything. Just a hobby.

Also, I thought paint was paint, I know there is clearcoat and non-clearcoated paint, but didnt know that there was really any difference between brands and car companies. How do I find out what the firmness of a paint is, and how does it affect the job, if you dont mind me asking?

[scrub]

Originally posted by BlackFirebird LS1
Thanks for the quick replies, this is by far the most helpful forum I have ever belonged to! Anyways, I will order soon and do what you suggested above.

Scrub, as for other cars, I am not goint to do a buisness or anything, or charge anything either, just family and friend's cars. I already have a friend that wants me to clay and get a good layer of polish and wax with the Dual Action polisher onto his green Dodge Caravan, and I said that I would be happy to as long as he was there to help (so he could learn to do it himself if he ever wanted to). I would also like to clean my mother's 99 Buick Century, which is a beige color, inside and out, because it really needs it. Lastly, I would like to clean my old car, which my sister now drives, a green 2000 Chevy Malibu. It definatly needs some help in some areas. But im not planning on doing a buisness or anything. Just a hobby.

That's how it started for me and many others too. I still detail part time. You're very generous with your time. Your friends and family are lucky and should be very happy with your efforts. To me it just boils down to time. If you have the time and desire then run all the cars through the process (polishes as needed). You looking at 6-8 hours just on the paint with the PC. Not to mention the inside. Last year that was no problem for me. Now with family and deadlines I can't spend that kind of time on one car. Can't how bout won't. It's hard work.

Originally posted by BlackFirebird LS1
Also, I thought paint was paint, I know there is clearcoat and non-clearcoated paint, but didnt know that there was really any difference between brands and car companies. How do I find out what the firmness of a paint is, and how does it affect the job, if you dont mind me asking?

This is getting out of my realm here. I've come to understand (through this forum) different automakers paint is harder than others. For example German cars normally have very hard paint. Late model vette's have very firm paint. No real way to measure this except with a buffer and product. With ALL cars start least aggressive and move up as needed. A product that might work on a Ford paint job might not touch swirls and webs in a BMW or Audi. I can attest to Audi. Very tough to remove defects with the PC and #80. I didn't try #83 as this was my new business partners car and I was showing different steps to the process.

[RamAirV1]

The clearcoat on F-bodies (Firebird and Camaro) is very hard. The only exception is the fiberglass hood on the Ram Air TA's. The hoods were painted by ASC, not GM and it is very soft. I think some times if you look at it too hard it swirls.

Once you get the swirls removed and the polish and wax applied, you will once again be glad that you have a black Formula! I like the black paint on the Firebirds because it is non-metallic. This will increase the results that you will see from #80/81 and NXT.

RamAirV1

[black240sx]

Any update on this BlackFirebirdLS1?

[BlackFirebird LS1]

black240sx: I recieved my G100 within days of ordering it, and I was planning to do the works this weekend, but it ended up being very cold outside, and it rained (and snowed a little) all weekend, so that sort threw all of my plans off. I hope to get to it next weekend, which, weather permitting, should work just fine. I will be sure to post pictures of what my car looks like afterwards!