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**Sydster** · Mar 22, 2008, 04:00 PM

Re: Using DA Polisher.

With the DA W8006 with #83 D.A.C.P is as far as you can go although Meguiar's does not recommend it some people had good results with W80006 and M105 (which would be more aggressive) on a DA too.

**brickyardz** · Mar 23, 2008, 12:33 PM

Re: Using DA Polisher.

Originally posted by Sydster View Post

With the DA W8006 with #83 D.A.C.P is as far as you can go although Meguiar's does not recommend it some people had good results with W80006 and M105 (which would be more aggressive) on a DA too.

As Sydster has stated, M105 is not reccommended for use with the DA but it is listed for use by hand in addition to rotary so depending on what your trying to correct, a targeted hand application with M105 may do the trick and still follow the manufactures use of the product.

What is the problem your trying to correct? Do you have any photos of it?

**pampos** · Mar 23, 2008, 12:55 PM

Re: Using DA Polisher.

I want to repair this.
I already tried #83 0n SFX-1 4" PAD.

**brickyardz** · Mar 25, 2008, 09:01 AM

Re: Using DA Polisher.

Those are really small photos and we can't really see any of the details. Can you post them larger without getting huge? If your going to re-size them, try 8x12 @72dpi. That should be a decent size and make them approximately 100K or less.

**pampos** · Mar 25, 2008, 09:31 AM

Re: Using DA Polisher.

i done my best : ) you can see the results and please judge my work and give me some advises...i post them twice (small and larger later).so please find the large images and tell me what you think.

Honda Inspire-judge my 2 days paint repair work,first time on such damage-lots of pic - Car Care Forums: Meguiar's Online

http://meguiarsonline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=22786

We encourage MOL members to show off their latest before & after results. We also welcome "Work in Progress" Threads. For Enthusiasts or Professional Detailers

Honda Inspire-judge my 2 days paint repair work,first time on such damage-lots of pic

**Mike Phillips** · Mar 25, 2008, 09:37 AM

Re: Using DA Polisher.

Your after pictures look pretty good, what's the problem you're still trying to remove?

**pampos** · Mar 25, 2008, 09:54 AM

Re: Using DA Polisher.

Originally posted by Mike Phillips View Post

Your after pictures look pretty good, what's the problem you're still trying to remove?

I was trying

there still there some water spots and a lot of scratches that were very deep and i was wondering if i had a possibility to totally remove them by DA but i guess no.you have to check the car by an angle and on direct light to see them but are still there

.

**Mike Phillips** · Mar 25, 2008, 10:16 AM

Re: Using DA Polisher.

Sometimes you need a rotary buffer to go after more serious paint defects, sometimes you need to learn to live with them as you don't want to remove too much clear coat as all the UV protection for the color coat is in the clear coat, thus the more clear you remove the less UV protection your paint will have to last over the service life of the car.

Sometimes you can use your UDM and you Sonus pads and shrink the size of your work area down and get the job done.

Have you read and studied this?

Tips & Techniques for using the G110, G100, G220 and the PC Dual Action Polisher
(These are all similar tools)

After teaching hundreds of classes here at Meguiar's, there are some common mistakes most people make when trying to remove swirls and scratches with a dual action polisher. Most of them have to do with technique.

Here's a list of the most common problems

Trying to work too large of an area at one time
Move the polisher too fast over the surface
Too low of speed setting for removing swirls
Too little pressure on the head of the unit
Too much pressure on the head of the unit so the pad quits rotating
Not keeping the pad flat while working your product
Too much product, too little product
Not cleaning the pad often enough

Here's a list of the solutions in matching order,

Shrink your work area down, the harder the paint the smaller the area you can work. The average area should be and average of about 16" by 16" up to 20" by 20" or so. You have to do some experimenting, (called a Test Spot), to find out how easy or how hard the defects are coming out of your car's paint system and then adjust your work area to the results of your Test Spot.
For removing defects out of the paint you want to use what we call a Slow Arm Speed. It's really easy to move the polisher too quickly because the sound of the motor spinning fast has a psychological effect to for some reason want to make people move the polisher fast. Also the way most people think is that, "If I move the polisher quickly, I'll get done faster", but it doesn't work that way.
When first starting out many people are scared of burning or swirling their paint, so they take the safe route of running the polisher at too low of a speed setting, again... this won't work. The action of the polisher is already g-e-n-t-l-e, you need the speed and specifically the pad rotating over the paint as well as the combination of time, (slow arm speed), together with the diminishing abrasives, the foam type, and the pressure to remove small particles of paint which is how your remove below surface defects like swirls or scratches. It's a leveling process that's somewhat difficult because the tool is safe/gentle while in most cases, modern clear coat paints are harder than traditional single stage paints and this makes them hard to work on. This is also why people get frustrated, they don't understand paint technology, all they know is their paint swirls easy and getting the swirls out is difficult and thus frustrating.
For the same reason as stated in #3, people are scared, or perhaps a better word is apprehensive, to apply too much pressure and the result of too little pressure is no paint is removed thus no swirls are removed.
Just the opposite of item #4, people think that by pushing harder on the polisher they can work faster and be more aggressive, but the truth is the clutch in the tool is a safety mechanism to prevent burning and will cause the pad to stop rotating, thus less cleaning or abrading action and once in a while this will lead a person to then post on the forum something like this, "Hey my pad doesn't rotate". There needs to be a balance of enough pressure to remove defects and keep the pad rotating but yet not too much pressure as to stop the rotating action. This balance is affected by a lot of things, things like type of chemical, some chemicals provide more lubrication and the pad will spin easier, curved surfaces or any raise in body lines will tend to stop the pad from rotating. This is where experience on how to address these areas comes into play or you do the best you can and move on. It's not a perfect tool, nor a perfect system, but it's almost always better than working/cleaning by hand.
Applying pressure in such a way as to put too much pressure to one side of the pad will cause it to stop rotating and thus decrease cleaning ability.
Too much product over lubricates the surface and this won't allow the diminishing abrasives to do their job plus it will increase the potential for messy splatter as well as cause pad saturation. Too little product will keep the pad from rotating due to no lubrication and there won't be enough diminishing abrasives to do any work. Again it's a balance that comes with experience, or another way of saying this would be it's a balance that comes with hours of buffing out a car to learn what to do and what not to do. Information like what you're reading here is just an edge to decrease your learning curve. Hope this is helping.
Most people don't clean their pad often enough and most of the time the reason for this is because they don't know they're supposed to clean their pad often and they don't know how to clean their pad. Again, that's why this forum is here to help you with both of these things. You should clean your pad after every application of product or every other application of product, your choice, most of the time cleaning your pad after every other application of product works pretty well. It enables you to work clean and enables the foam pad, the polisher and the next application of fresh product too all work effectively. How to clean your pad will be addressed below sooner versus later, but not at the time of this posting. (Sorry, I'm behind a keyboard, not a video camera

The first 4 are the most common. Can't tell you how many times we hear a comment like this from someone in the garage after demonstrating the correct technique

"That's what I'm doing wrong"

The dual action polisher is a gentle tool, that's why people like it. People are afraid of machines because they're worried they're going to either instill swirls or burn through the paint. When they learn that this is pretty hard to do with this machine, so after enough research or after watching a demonstration they learn to trust it and try it.

Summary: People like the dual action polisher because it's oscillating action is safe and gentle to the surface.

Now follow me on this...
For the same reason people love the dual action polisher, (it's safe and gentle), a segment of people get frustrated with it because it won't remove all defects all the time. It won't tackle serious or deep defects quickly and easily. It won't always work on really hard paints. So for the same reason people love this tool, they also hate it, they just don't know why. Maybe after reading this post they will understand.

This is the reason this thread is so widely read and you can learn a lot from it if you'll only take the time to read through it.

PC + 83 not "Cutting" it! - The Limits of the Dual Action Polisher

Even the pictures of the paint on the white truck on the first page and the story behind it are powerful and REAL (This writer took them and did the testing with both the G100/PC and the RB).

When the G100/PC with a strong cleaner/polish like M83 and our W-8006 polishing pad doesn't remove the defects to your satisfaction or within an acceptable time limit the answer is not to get more aggressive with a more aggressive pad or chemical or both, the answer is to switch to a more powerful machine like the rotary buffer and or take the car to a Pro who knows how to use a rotary buffer, or learn to live with the defects.

Hope this helps...

**pampos** · Mar 25, 2008, 10:34 AM

Re: Using DA Polisher.

Thanks Mike.
I already tried some similar things by my self and i noticed that:

1)When i am using 5 or 6 speed on UDM, with pressure just a step before the pad stop rotate, the polish is coming into the center of the pad and dries quickly and dry polish come over the pad

2)As you said i don't know when is the time to stop.i mean after how many passes i have to give up trying removing some defects before the clear coat? : )

3) on solid paints (w/out clear coat) is it easier to remove some deeper scratches?

4) I am trying to work on small areas as you said but i don't know when is the time to stop : )

5)what is the ideal quantity of polish?i load 5 small "spots of polish" around and in the middle of the pad.

6)how i can understand that i have to load more polish?

7)When moving from one area to other i have to load more polish or i have to try something first?

Thanks once again

**Mike Phillips** · Mar 25, 2008, 11:20 AM

Re: Using DA Polisher.