Why M84 and M85 can't be used with the PC?

[fishbonezken]

Why can't we use

M84 Compund Power Cleaner

and

M85 Diamond Cut Compound 2.0

with the PC?

*sorry if there's a thread on this already. Or if this has been explained somewhere.

[Mike Phillips]

Re: Why M84 and M85 can't be used with the PC?

Most people don't understand there are multiple types of abrasives and different abrasives offer different characteristics and features. Formulas, the embodiment of all ingredients are also very different from one formula to another. The M84 and M85 compounds are aggressive compounds but their ability and effectiveness rely on the power of a rotary buffer.

There is such a HUGE difference between the power exerted by a rotary buffer and all other machines used to polish paint.

You're question is a good one and a questions asked often, here's a question for you out of curiosity... have you ever used a rotary buffer, as in to buff out entire cars?

[fishbonezken]

Re: Why M84 and M85 can't be used with the PC?

Most people don't understand there are multiple types of abrasives and different abrasives offer different characteristics and features. Formulas, the embodiment of all ingredients are also very different from one formula to another. The M84 and M85 compounds are aggressive compounds but their ability and effectiveness rely on the power of a rotary buffer.

There is such a HUGE difference between the power exerted by a rotary buffer and all other machines used to polish paint.

You're question is a good one and a questions asked often, here's a question for you out of curiosity... have you ever used a rotary buffer, as in to buff out entire cars?

Thanks for the quick response Mike. No, I only have experience with a PC.

Can't we use the PC with M84 and perhaps, work it over a 2'x2' area longer? until the abrasives have broken down?

maybe not as fast as a rotary buffer would, but over longer periods of polishing with a Dual-Action polisher, is it possible?

[fishbonezken]

Re: Why M84 and M85 can't be used with the PC?

bump...anyone?

[Mike Phillips]

Re: Why M84 and M85 can't be used with the PC?

bump...anyone?

My answer the first time actually answers your re-asking of the question a second time.

[Michael Stoops]

Re: Why M84 and M85 can't be used with the PC?

I think what it really comes down to is this - what do you need to do to get the most out of the product you're using, and to achieve the desired results.

Sure, in the long run you can use any product with any machine, but you run the risk of the product gumming up, being hard to remove, or maybe just not get the most out of the product, which is basically just a waste of time, energy and money. In the case of the products in question, like Mike said, the DA just does not have the oomph to allow them to work to their potential.

So look at it as using the right tool for the right job. Sure, you could use a hammer to drive a screw into a piece of wood, but is that the right tool for the job? No.

[fishbonezken]

Re: Why M84 and M85 can't be used with the PC?

My answer the first time actually answers your re-asking of the question a second time.

Oops, sorry Mike Phillips, so it's not possible then, to use m84/m85 with the PC with longer polishing time per panel.

I think what it really comes down to is this - what do you need to do to get the most out of the product you're using, and to achieve the desired results.

Sure, in the long run you can use any product with any machine, but you run the risk of the product gumming up, being hard to remove, or maybe just not get the most out of the product, which is basically just a waste of time, energy and money. In the case of the products in question, like Mike said, the DA just does not have the oomph to allow them to work to their potential.

So look at it as using the right tool for the right job. Sure, you could use a hammer to drive a screw into a piece of wood, but is that the right tool for the job? No.

Gotcha, point taken. Thanks!

[RamAirV1]

Re: Why M84 and M85 can't be used with the PC?

What he's trying to say is that the G100 (aka PC) cannot produce enough heat to break down the diminishing abrasives in #84 and #85. It doesn't move enough paint, do enough work in other words. The diminishing abrasives in #84 and #85 are not the same as those used in other cleaners and cleaner/polishes like #82 and #80. #83 can be used with the DA, but it is more difficult to use, as technique is more important than with say #80. You have to work the #83 longer with the G-100, yet you must also be careful not to dry buff it! So I save #83 for more difficult scratches and swirls.

RamAirV1

[Wideopentuning]

Re: Why M84 and M85 can't be used with the PC?

I was actually sent some 84 for some reason when I ordered my G100. The results with it using PC sucked even when using the maroon cutting pad and I wasn't sure what was going on. I later found out I was not using the right product. Don't waste your time.

[TH0001]

Re: Why M84 and M85 can't be used with the PC?

What he's trying to say is that the G100 (aka PC) cannot produce enough heat to break down the diminishing abrasives in #84 and #85. It doesn't move enough paint, do enough work in other words. The diminishing abrasives in #84 and #85 are not the same as those used in other cleaners and cleaner/polishes like #82 and #80. #83 can be used with the DA, but it is more difficult to use, as technique is more important than with say #80. You have to work the #83 longer with the G-100, yet you must also be careful not to dry buff it! So I save #83 for more difficult scratches and swirls.

RamAirV1

I don't want to nit-pick, but its not the heat that breaks down the abbrasives, its friction and pressure. Heat is a by product.

[Mike Phillips]

Re: Why M84 and M85 can't be used with the PC?

I don't want to nit-pick, but its not the heat that breaks down the abrasives, its friction and pressure. Heat is a by product.

Thanks for adding this, somewhere on the forum I know I've posted this at least a couple of times, just not sure where?

Why does everyone think heat is an essential component?

It's a by-product

[Junebug]

Re: Why M84 and M85 can't be used with the PC?

You can use it, I did. I had to get scratches out of a white 2002 BMW 325i and the owner told me if I couldn't - he'd have the car repainted, money talks you know. Well, all I had at the time was a PC, a wool pad and #84 and #85. I tried the 84 and liked the way the oil gave you unlimited working time. I held the PC on 6 over the scratches for a minute (yeah, that's right, a minute - I timed it) and then checked the result. Most of the scratches were gone, so I did another minute and they were all gone. I had to use all the pressure I could put on it - and I'm a fairly strong 210 pound dude. Lucky for me the scratches were just on the hood and a few spots on the top. Looked like someone used a brillo pad on it - but you couldn't catch your fingernail on them. I'm glad I bought a Makita 9227 - cause that was more work than I like to put out!