Announcement

**RamAirV1** · Nov 7, 2005, 01:32 PM

How experienced are you with using a rotary buffer? The swirls were probably instilled by the rotary buffer. Mike will be able to tell you what you're doing wrong if anything. I won't go near a rotary until I can practice on a beater first LOL!

RamAirV1

**RDVT4ME** · Nov 7, 2005, 02:18 PM

You may have buffed too long. If the product dries and you continue to buff, you will induce swirl marks. If you have pictures that may help with any diagnosis. If Mike chimes in, I bet he'll want to see pictures. Also, what speed were you using with the rotary? That would be helpful information also.

Another thing to look at is the pad. Make sure they are clean. Pads with dried product can also induce swirls.

**Pete-FWA** · Nov 7, 2005, 04:34 PM

Slightly slower speeds with the Speed Glaze (1000-1200 RPM) might help a bit. Are you polishing until it's dry, or are you leaving the polishing rouge to wipe by hand?

Did the DA application of M80 help or change much at all? I wonder if you might need a different pad, the softer W9000 or W9006 with the Speed Glaze.

Also, was the pad you used brand new, perhaps not broken in yet? When new, they're a bit stiff and can leave some marks without being conditioned first.

**Shiny Lil Detlr** · Nov 7, 2005, 07:46 PM

Originally posted by RamAirV1
How experienced are you with using a rotary buffer? The swirls were probably instilled by the rotary buffer. Mike will be able to tell you what you're doing wrong if anything. I won't go near a rotary until I can practice on a beater first LOL!

RamAirV1

I'd tend to think that's the culprit, also. You should probably step back to a DA machine to develop technique, and THEN start tackling the rotary.

**Hannibal** · Nov 7, 2005, 08:55 PM

I am fixing to get some pads along with my new DA. WHat should I do to condition the pads before using them?

**Marcus** · Nov 7, 2005, 10:35 PM

I am using the rotarý, yes. No matter how experienced I am with it (which I would say I am, I have been using the rotary for 4 years now), I used the rotary with both products, I would expect that they would both fail on me in that case. The rotary was used in the speeds around 1200-1400 rpm's, it changes constantly depending on how much pressure I use on the rotary, of course I compensate by lowering the speed when I release pressure... but, yes, somewhere in between there..

I used brand new pads for both products and made sure that the pads were suffienctly wet (by first X-ing them and applying small amounts of product in the outer parts of the pad)

I buffed until the product nearly went away, it still left a haze but you could defintely see that the product was in the process of drying up...

Regarding the pictures, I am sorry to say that I actually forgot to bring the camera with me from work yesterday! I was planning to, so, no pics, sorry!

I hope I answered most of your questions now

wonder if you might need a different pad, the softer W9000 or W9006 with the Speed Glaze.

Yes, I was thinking the same myself. However I've seen lots and lots of howto's here on how to use the M80, haven't they all been using the W8006? I was about to wip out the W9006 but thought I would wait, no use ruining one of the few pads I have with M80 if it wasn't meant to...

/Marcus

**Djmigs** · Nov 7, 2005, 11:42 PM

there are many variables.....

one could be you dry till it buffed out(no product leftover/dry)...

second can be you didn't work the product properly(break down of the diminishing abrasives)...

what i have notice is for example polish manufacter/brands not all work the same or equal.....so what work one way may not work for another....just a thought

I'm sure mike and other mol members will fill in with more experience then i....

**Marcus** · Nov 8, 2005, 12:24 AM

second can be you didn't work the product properly(break down of the diminishing abrasives)...

- Correct, but wouldn't you think that the abrasives would break down similarly with the M80 as with the M83? Or do you have to have a special technique with the M80 that the M83 doesn't require?

I am getting almost perfect results with the M83 but not with the M80, it should be the other way around

(That was why I began to think that M80 should be used with the W9006 instead of the W8006)

/M

**zey** · Nov 8, 2005, 03:30 AM

Hi Marcus, I would suggest you to try using M82 with W-9006 to buff the area again using rotary. After that, use DA machine with M82 again before putting on LSP. That's what I learn from the Meguiar's How to Remove Paint Defects video. I know black paint is very delicate, I too get swirls from M80/W-8006/RB, but that could be my poor technique.

**Marcus** · Nov 8, 2005, 05:57 AM

Hey Zey!

Yeah, I guess that is the correct method.. I know.. But.. But.. Well, here we go again! It costs too much money!

I made a choice when I ordered my things from the US that I was going to use the M80, so I just got a gallon of that and the M83.. The M82 feels like a product that comes in between and I couldn't prioritize the M82 high enough.. (The M82 is at £27 here, too expensive just to try and see)

Also, I would feel totally ok with the M80 leaving some kind of swirling IF only the M83 did! That was why I was thinking that maybe I handled the M80 in the wrong way....

Hopefully I will get the time tonight to give it another shot, if so I am going to bring the camera this time!

Thanks for all suggestions!

/Marcus

**zey** · Nov 8, 2005, 06:04 AM

Marcus, for extra information, May I know is your car still having factory paintwork? If yes, what brand is it? If no, what sort of clearcoat you have it refinished? Thanks.

**RDVT4ME** · Nov 8, 2005, 06:06 AM

Marcus

Sounds like you are doing all the right stuff. I use the yellow pad with #80 and a rotary all the time and get positive results so I don't think it's the #80. When I make my final passes with the rotary, I use no pressure. Just let the weight of the machine do the work. That seems to work to get any swirl marks out that may have been caused by buffing.

Hang in there, this forum will help you find the answer!

**Marcus** · Nov 8, 2005, 06:26 AM

RDVT4ME

Hang in there, this forum will help you find the answer!

- Thanks for the encouragement

Zey

Marcus, for extra information, May I know is your car still having factory paintwork? If yes, what brand is it? If no, what sort of clearcoat you have it refinished? Thanks.

Uhm, let's see.. Some parts have been repainted (the hood), I tried both areas (started with the roof which hasn't been repainted and then also tried on the hood, that was were I taped off the areas) So, mostly factory paintwork except the hood. The car is a BMW Alpina B8 with the color Schwarz II (black 2). I dunno what the different types of clearcoats are, but there is a clearcoat at least, even on the repainted areas...

I noted that the repainted areas aren't as touchy, delicate as one might think it was going to be.. it behaved very much similarly as the rest of the paint except that it has a lot less scratches.. The hood was repainted May 2004.

/Marcus

**Mike Phillips** · Nov 8, 2005, 07:24 AM

Just to drill down a little deeper...

Are you seeing the same swirl results from the M80/W-8006 combination on all the painted panels?

Just to note, it's easier to inspect flat/horizontal panels.

Announcement

DACP performs better than Speed Glaze?

DACP performs better than Speed Glaze?

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment