what to do

[TDI]

My car is well maintained washed weekly and has recieved about five coats of NXT wax over the past three months. Problem is I have had both passenger side doors replaced (T-boned at a round about) and I'm not sure what to do. Should I start all over again with the five step process or should I just wax the doors after washing and claying the car. Any help or ideas would be greatly appreciated. Regards TDI

[Ranger72]

If the doors are still freshly painted do NOT apply wax to them. Aske your painter how long to wait before applying wax, they normally say something from 30-60 days. You have to know if the painter blended paint towards the fender and rear bumper so that any color difference would be less noticeable. If he blended, that means the whole side of the car has been cleared, thus needing polishing.

[Murr1525]

They are factory painted doors, so it is all cured and everything?

If so, then doing the full 5-steps to the doors will be best, as even fresh paint oftens end up with contaminants that should be removed before waxing, etc.

[TDI]

I'm pretty sure they were painted last week, and the front guard looks as if it had been removed so I'm assuming it's been blended front to rear. Also is it to much for me to expect the doors to be hung perfectly (like the uneffected side of the car). Thanks for your quick response. Regards TDI.

[TDI]

Not sure if the parts (from VW Germany) were pre-painted as I was supplied with touch-up paint? when I picked the car up from my insurer. Regards TDI

[Ranger72]

It is not too much to ask for the doors to be hung perfectly. Any reputable body shop should be able to shim them so that they are at least 99% there. If the doors arent sitting right, it maybe be a sign of subframe damage. Have them measure everthing to make sure its stragiht.

[Accumulator]

I've never heard of Porsche/Audi/VW doors coming prepainted, the ones for Audis sure don't.

I'd use #5 (or #3/#7/#81/Deep Crystal #2) on them until the paint has cured. I do this for about three months but I'm extra careful.

[TDI]

I have my car back now and been told not to polish/wax for 2-3 months, but would it be ok to clay the affected area. Regards TDI.

[Mike Phillips]

This will shed some light on the subject...

http://meguiarsonline.com/forums/sho...&threadid=3704

[TDI]

Thanks Mike.

[TDI]

Just got off the phone with the crash repairer and he told me that the painted panels had been baked and cured and I can wash polish and wax right now if I wanted. Does this sound right to you.

[Mike Phillips]

Meguiar's recommends following the recommendations of you painter as he knows his paint system best...

and this...

Paint Needs To Breathe

Words mean things, just ask any Lawyer. Floating around on the Internet, and discussed for decades among car enthusiasts is the myth that paint needs to breathe.

Or is it a myth?

It depends on how literal you read into the words. If you apply the common definition used for the word breath, then "No", paint does not need to breathe. If however you take a moment to understand the idea that is being expressed with this word, then I think you'll understand why the word breathe is used when someone says, or posts to the Internet that "Paint needs to breathe".

The below is just my guestimation as to the story behind the theory or myth that paint needs to breathe. I may be wrong, but my years of working with both painters, detailers and serious car enthusiasts as well as teaching detailing classes makes me think that if I'm not dead on, I'm at least in the ball park. With that said, here my explanation of how the saying, "Paint needs to breathe" originated.

For the last 50 or so years, when a person would have their car painted, upon retrieving it from the painter, the painter would typically recommend that the owner wait for a period of time before applying a coat of wax or some type of paint sealant that seals the paint. The normal period of time that most painters recommend is anywhere from 30 to 60 days and sometimes longer, depending upon the painter. The reason for this waiting period is to allow the different solvents and other additives enough time to fully evaporate out of and off of the surface.

Wax and/or paint sealants, whether natural or synthetic, or a blend of both of these ingredients, seals the paint by coating over the surface and filling into any microscopic surface imperfections creating a barrier coating over the surface. This blocks, or inhibits these solvents from escaping through evaporation, or outgassing. Solvents also called thinners and reducers are used to thin the paint down so that it can be atomized into a spray when applied with a paint gun using compressed air.

When a customer arrives at a body shop or a dealership to pick up their car with its freshly applied paint, most painters will tell the customer to wait a certain number of days before applying wax, or paint sealant over their new paint job. If the customer agrees, then that's probably as far as the discussion goes.

If the customer asks further questions as to why they must wait before applying a protective coating to their investment, then it is my belief that most painters would do their best to explain to the customer, in easy to understand terminology, so that the customer will understand and comply with his request. This is where I think the saying, paint needs to breathe, originated.

I don't think most painters would try to explain that the solvents need to outgas in order for the paint to fully dry and harden, instead, I think they would use a more simple approach and merely tell the customer that their new paint needs to breathe.

The above fictional analogy is probably as accurate as any assumption as to how the theory that paint needs to breath was started. (I'm open to other theories however.)

People that understand the painting process understand that paint doesn't literally need to breathe; they do understand that fresh paint needs to outgas. This means that for a period of time, the solvents and other carrying agents, which are used to dilute paint to a thin viscosity so that it can be sprayed out of a pressurized air sprayer, need to work their way out of the paint through the evaporation process, also referred to as outgassing.

Read the below two scenarios and then decide for yourself, which scenario sounds more plausible.

In an effort to explain to their customers why paint manufactures recommend waiting for at least 30 days to pass before applying a coating of wax or a paint sealant, the painter can,

• 1. Try to explain the outgassing process over and over again throughout their career.
  2. Use a simple analogy that the average person can understand without challenging the painter's judgment or expertise.

My personal guess is the second option.

If the simple analogy works, it will accomplish the painter's goal and allow the painter to get back to work, not spend his time explaining the painting process to each customer as they pick up their car. The goal of course is to prevent the customer from sealing the paint with some type of wax or paint sealant until the paint has completely dried and the out-gassing process is completely over.

• * Paint does not need to breathe in the literal sense that you and I need to breathe as living human beings.
  * Paint does need to breathe in the sense that fresh paint needs to outgas.

Of course, in the last 50 years or so since World War II ended and the car crazy culture really revved up in America, (no pun intended), the result has been explosive growth in the collision repair and custom painting industries. It should be no surprise that the idea that paint needs to breathe has finally reached enough of a critical mass as to be the topic of discussion on numerous discussion forums as well as anywhere a couple of car enthusiasts gather to talk shop.

Depending on how literal you want to read into it, when someone states "Paint needs to breathe", what they probably mean is that fresh paint needs to outgas, they probably just don't know, or understand the term outgas, and/or they are confused like many people who have gone before them and are operating under the wrong idea innocently.

A different, but related version of the above would be someone that applies the same idea that paint needs to breathe to the paint on a brand new car which is also false unless the new car has been painted within the last 30 to 90 days. Sometimes during shipping from the assembly plant to the dealership show room floor, new vehicles are damaged and need repair including repainting. If all the paint on the car is the factory original paint, then it was baked on at the factory as it traveled down the assembly line and was completely cured before it left the assembly plant and it is perfectly safe to apply a coating of wax or a paint sealant of some type. If the car has been repainted due to damage during transit, then the areas with fresh paint should not be sealed with wax until the recommended waiting period has passed.

Well, this is my stab at the "Paint needs to breathe theory".

Comments? Click here to post them to this article

Mike

[TDI]

Thanks again for the info Mike, but I have one final question. I have about 5-6 coats of NXT wax minus the passenger side doors and rear quarter panel, should I use meguiars paint cleaner to remove this wax and start all over again or could I get away with claying the car followed by deep crystal polish and then two coats of NXT wax with a 24hr gap between them. Thankyou again. Regards TDI.

[Accumulator]

Originally posted by TDI
Just got off the phone with the crash repairer and he told me that the painted panels had been baked and cured and I can wash polish and wax right now if I wanted. Does this sound right to you.

When my cars have paint work they get cured at as high a temp as you can do with an assembled car. I still wait the 2-3 months. Sometimes you can even smell the outgassing taking place many weeks later.

Not intending to :argue with your painter, but note that he might be trying to tell you what he figures you want to hear The only *real* downside of premature waxing of repaints is that the paint often won't reach it's maximum (potential) hardness. Most painters would assume that most owners would never notice the difference.

I'd just let the repainted areas look a little different while they cure. Better safe than sorry.

[Mike Phillips]

Originally posted by TDI
Thanks again for the info Mike, but I have one final question. I have about 5-6 coats of NXT wax minus the passenger side doors and rear quarter panel, should I use Meguiar's paint cleaner to remove this wax and start all over again or could I get away with claying the car followed by deep crystal polish and then two coats of NXT wax with a 24hr gap between them. Thank you again. Regards TDI.

Do these waxed areas have dry spray/overspray on them?

Is then clay them and the simply re-wax. If the non-painted original areas are still in great shape I would go through the entire system again.

Good luck, have fun...