Swirl Removal NOT Working... Need Help

[Jbirk]

Years ago, I had success (different car/paint) with #83 followed by #80 on the original G100 and the SoftBuff pads - back when the finishing pad wasn't black.


Anyway, here is the issue...

Car is a 2013 Infiniti G37 (Liquid Platinum - looks "silver" to me) and it is finally swirled.


Since I lent the G100 to a friend years ago and he liked it too much to return it I bought a newer G110v2 probably about five (5) months ago and just got around to using it.

_______________

It has the Bigger W68DA backing plate, and I bought several of the Genuine SoftBuff 2.0 pads. I marked the backing plate with a Silver Sharpie, so I can see it rotating.



What I tried... Didn't work well enough:

What I did was use a black finishing pad, specifically W9207, on it and used some M205, which I presume for all intents and purposes is like the #80 I used to like in 2005/2006 on it is supposedly more user-friendly and is rumored to finish better than M82!


My Process that did not work well enough:

1. I wiped down the panel with a clean microfiber and plenty of detailing spray - specifically Final Inspection (simply because it was in a spray bottle nearby)
2. I clayed that panel with the same stuff... and wiped away ALL the residue.
3. Taped off he panel with blue masking tape
4. Put on a new, virgin W9207 SoftBuff 2 Finishing Pad that was perfectly clean having NEVER touched anything dirty (emphasis added)
5. Spread #205 over the entire pad to cover it completely.
6. Spread it around and worked it at speed #4 for several slow section passes with moderate pressure. (no progress at all)
7. Applied it again this time on speed 5 and later speed 6 ... Pushed it as hard as I could without significantly slowing the pad... Made at least twelve (12) slow section passes.

There is SOME improvement to the swirls and overall the panel looks a bit glossier, but fewer than half the swirls were removed.


What do I do next being this did not get the job done?

I presume I need to get more aggressive with it?


I could not find any M83 from years ago (and even if I did it would be 8 years old)...


What I DO have:

1. I have the Polishing Pads and the Cutting Pads W8207 and W7207 respectively.
2. I have some Ultimate Polish, which I doubt will help (i.e. I feel it M80:M82 as M205:UP am I wrong?)
3. I have SwirlX and ScratchX
4. I have Ultimate Compound and M105


What should I try next with what I have? Should I simply change pads and retry #205? Should I jump to SwirlX or ScratchX OR straight to UC/105???

[davey g-force]

Re: Swirl Removal NOT Working... Need Help

Yep, sounds like you need to get more aggressive.

1. Try the M205 on a polishing pad. That combo of pad/product you used is very mild for removing swirls.
2. If that doesn't work, step up to ScratchX on a polishing pad
3. If that doesn't work, step up to UC on a polishing pad.
4. If that doesn't work, report back. There are still options...

[Selectchoice]

Re: Swirl Removal NOT Working... Need Help

Try M205 with the yellow Polishing Pad and speed 5. Confine your working area to about 12" x 12" at most and use enough downward pressure to almost stop the pad spinning. Go over the work area two to three times at most, stop and wipe off any remaining residue.

That should remove all/more of the swirls, however if the swirls are bad you may need to try that again with a new polishing pad using Ultimate Compound.

[The Guz]

Re: Swirl Removal NOT Working... Need Help

Try M205 with the yellow Polishing Pad and speed 5. Confine your working area to about 12" x 12" at most and use enough downward pressure to almost stop the pad spinning. Go over the work area two to three times at most, stop and wipe off any remaining residue.

That should remove all/more of the swirls, however if the swirls are bad you may need to try that again with a new polishing pad using Ultimate Compound.

This is exactly what I would do.

FYI 5" pads run better on this style of DA. Your next upgrade should be the new foam discs.

[Jbirk]

Re: Swirl Removal NOT Working... Need Help

This is exactly what I would do.

FYI 5" pads run better on this style of DA. Your next upgrade should be the new foam discs.

Which discs do you recommend?

Obviously, I will need to buy a smaller backing plate too... Which one?

[The Guz]

Re: Swirl Removal NOT Working... Need Help

These and yes you would need a backing plate to go along with them.

http://www.meguiarsonline.com/forums/showthread.php?61956-NEW!-DA-Foam-Discs-and-Backing-Plates

[Don]

Re: Swirl Removal NOT Working... Need Help

5. Spread #205 over the entire pad to cover it completely.

THAT could be your problem, too much polish. It takes very little UP to cover your working area, on a new/clean pad, I start with 4 dime-sized drops. A little bit goes a LONG way. You may have had so much polish on there that the lubricating properties in the polish overwhelmed the cutting power

I presume I need to get more aggressive with it?

Perhaps, try the UP again, but only use the 4 dime-sized drops or a single thin "X" across the pad, UP spreads VERY well, and has a LONG working time.

What should I try next with what I have? Should I simply change pads and retry #205? Should I jump to SwirlX or ScratchX OR straight to UC/105???

Again, perhaps. I would try the UP again with the smaller amounts to see if that changes your results.

I just used UP, and a Meguiar's yellow polishing pad on my car which was lightly swirled from the winter. I used it the way I described above and the panels came out flawless.

[Jbirk]

Re: Swirl Removal NOT Working... Need Help

I just used UP, and a Meguiar's yellow polishing pad on my car which was lightly swirled from the winter. I used it the way I described above and the panels came out flawless.

Just got around to trying that.... it worked great. I used Ultimate Compound on a Yellow Softbuff 2.0 pad and the panels came out flawless for me too.!!

I applied a coat of Ultimate Paste Wax where I worked.


That said, I am going to follow-up and polish out the whole blasted car with #205 after I finish compounding the troubled spots.

[Don]

Re: Swirl Removal NOT Working... Need Help

Just got around to trying that.... it worked great. I used Ultimate Compound on a Yellow Softbuff 2.0 pad and the panels came out flawless for me too.!!

I applied a coat of Ultimate Paste Wax where I worked.


That said, I am going to follow-up and polish out the whole blasted car with #205 after I finish compounding the troubled spots.

Congrats.

[Michael Stoops]

Re: Swirl Removal NOT Working... Need Help

When it comes to defect removal and achieving maximum gloss on any paint, the textbook approach would be something like this:

Correct: Ultimate Compound (or M105, M100 etc)/foam cutting disc/5800 opm on the MT300 or similar DA/moderate pressure/slow passes/small work area/4 passes over the area
Polish/refine: Ultimate Polish (or M205)/foam polishing disc/4800 opm on the MT300 or similar DA/lighter pressure/maybe slightly faster passes/maybe a slightly larger work area/2 to 3 passes over the area
Protect: Ultimate Wax (or Gold Class, Paint Protect, etc)/foam finishing disc/3800 opm/light pressure/faster passes/large work area/2 passes over every square inch of the vehicle

Again, that's a textbook approach and it's going to work very well on the vast majority of vehicles. The problem with using a textbook approach is in getting too caught up in it. It's a guide, a starting point. The first time you touch any car you have no real idea how it's going to respond. So.... you need to start someplace, right? Do that test spot to get a feel. Always!!

Now, the more cars you polish the more you get a feel for what constitutes bad paint, and what constitutes really bad paint. That becomes your starter gauge for your first step. With experience you can look at a car and decide maybe you don't need a compound at all and you can likely get away with M205...... but you're still prepared for the paint to surprise you by being really, crazy hard. And so you adapt. You learn from, and lean on, your past experiences. Keep you eyes open, pay attention to what's happening - the good and the bad - and think about how your input is changing the paint. Sometimes a single step can bring the paint to a crazy high level, sometimes you need 2 or three to get the same results. As we say, the paint wants what the paint wants. So give it to it. But to do that you need to be able to read the paint, and that comes with experience.

Do things in steps though. Just because a very mild approach doesn't get the job done is not a green light to grab the most aggressive process you can think of. We see too many people doing just that, and it rarely proves to be the best method. Davey's approach is basically sound:

Yep, sounds like you need to get more aggressive.

1. Try the M205 on a polishing pad. That combo of pad/product you used is very mild for removing swirls.
2. If that doesn't work, step up to ScratchX on a polishing pad
3. If that doesn't work, step up to UC on a polishing pad.
4. If that doesn't work, report back. There are still options...

Even so, given the original description of the process and results with M205 and knowing that, when used fairly aggressively M205 is capable of some pretty darn good results - but that didn't happen here, we would have gone straight to UC on a polishing pad. Heck, given the generally outstanding results we're getting with the new DA foam cutting disc, we might even have gone that route but just eased up on the pressure. The basic answer though, and the one that ultimately played out with great success as Jbirk reported, is that something more aggressive was needed.

Finally, Jbirk, we love that you plan on going after the whole car with M205 after correcting the trouble spots. M205 can do wonders for the clarity and gloss on any color paint, and can really make the metallcs and pearls "pop" like crazy. We wouldn't detail without it!!