Ultimate Compound -vs- Ultra Finishing #205. Correction and finish. Input please...

[Ralph III]

Hello All,
I just got a Meguiars G110v2 DA polisher and need some input in regards to finishing results with the following products.

*Ultra Finishing Polish #205: I really enjoyed working with this product and it reminds me of some compounds/polishes I used to buff with professionally years ago with a rotary. Working time and cleanup was excellent.

*Ultimate Compound: Again, I really enjoyed working with this product as well and cleanup was very easy.

*Fine-Cut Cleaner #2: Equally good polish but I preferred the other two as cleanup was much easier.



All three products did an excellent job of restoring color, depth and clarity. The UC and #2 seemed to leave a slightly deeper shine or wet look. I did a test spot with all three products on my green tractor (yes, I did) last night and it looked good. I then did a test spot on my bosses black Chevy PU today, which I'm getting ready to finish out, with #205 and UC. They both did an excellent job with the UC again leaving a very slight deeper shine/wet look. It was close though.


Anyhow, my inquiry is this; none of the products did a very good job of removing even really light scratches IMO. So I need some input from you in tweaking Meguiars compounds/polishes/technique in order to get better results, as the Meguiars products and a dual action polisher is new to me.

Note: I was using a Meguiars 6.5in polishing pad and made 5-6 passes both vertically and horizontally (2ft x 2ft) with moderate pressure (12 or 15lbs) on speed #5. I let up on the last two passes with each product, which may have negated #205's effects given it is a non-diminishing abrasive?

1. How much of an increase in cutting power of these products would I see if I used a DA "cutting pad"?
2. Should I have buffed longer or made more passes with the DA? I never buffed to the point where the products were gone (dry surface) but to the point where most of it was gone and only a light residue was left.
3. Should I have made a second pass?

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4. Would I see the greatest cutting ability of the #205 polish if I used my rotary buffer with a polishing pad or cutting pad? Would my results be the same as it was with my DA (deep finish, no swirls)? I would much prefer this product/method because it could be used with both my DA and rotary, the later of which I'm very comfortable/good with. If so, what Meguiars products can I use that would make the #205 results pop even more with that deep wet look? I currently use Ultimate Wax, btw.

--Otherwise--

Is there similar products, or a different polish, that you would recommend to reach my goal? All the above products finished out as I desire but they needed a little more cutting ability for light scratches.

God Bless,
Ralph

[gclark26]

Ralph
You have the right products but using the wrong psds.
1. Change to 5.5" pads for faster rotation
2. Use LC orange pad with M105 for more cut
3. Use LC white pad with M205 to remove light marring and increase gloss.
4. Use LC blue pad with UP for jeweling th e paint for show car finish

[The Guz]

Re: Ultimate Compound -vs- Ultra Finishing #205. Correction and finish. Input pleas

You are not using the wrong pads per say. It would be your technique that needs to be adjusted. Now I do agree that you should go with 5.5" pads and a 5" backing plate. It will allow you to take more advantage of the DA's power. Smaller pads means less rotation. I can't tell you how many passes you should make with the product as it depends on your working environment.

Which pads are you actually using? The soft buff or the new thin pads? Knowing this we can help you out even more.

Another thing to note is that GM paint is known to be on the hard side. Again that depends on your test spot. The beauty of hard paint is that is come sometimes finish LSP ready.

I find that UW gives a nice wet look on dark paint. You could try NXT or M21 as it gives a slightly different look than UW. These are also sealants. If you are looking for a carnauba then my vote goes for M26. It depends on if your boss is looking for protection or looks. My thought would be a sealant so it gives him longer protection.

[Ralph III]

Re: Ultimate Compound -vs- Ultra Finishing #205. Correction and finish. Input pleas

You are not using the wrong pads per say. It would be your technique that needs to be adjusted. Now I do agree that you should go with 5.5" pads and a 5" backing plate. It will allow you to take more advantage of the DA's power. Smaller pads means less rotation. I can't tell you how many passes you should make with the product as it depends on your working environment.

Which pads are you actually using? The soft buff or the new thin pads? Knowing this we can help you out even more.

Another thing to note is that GM paint is known to be on the hard side. Again that depends on your test spot. The beauty of hard paint is that is come sometimes finish LSP ready.

I find that UW gives a nice wet look on dark paint. You could try NXT or M21 as it gives a slightly different look than UW. These are also sealants. If you are looking for a carnauba then my vote goes for M26. It depends on if your boss is looking for protection or looks. My thought would be a sealant so it gives him longer protection.

Hey Guz and thanks for the continued support!

I have the Meguiars 6.5 Soft Buff Polishing and Finishing pads as that is what came with my DA polisher. As noted in my other posts, it's really how I want to use that tool (polishing or finishing). I've ordered some 7in Soft Buff 2.0 cutting pads for my rotary, which is how I want to reserve that tool (cutting) but it will be next week before those arrive. I just have no idea what to expect with the rotary and M205 where cutting ability is concerned.

I think I'm going to go ahead and pick up some M105 as well especially after seeing a couple of online demonstrations. At least I will have the benefit of determining which pad/compound will best meet my goals. I'm just waiting for my wife to scream at me for purchasing all this gear when I have no intention on doing this professionally again, ha.

I have a couple of questions in regards to M105, so I may start a separate thread for that.

Take care,
Ralph

[drumdan]

How are you preparing the pad with product?

How much product are you applying to the pad for the subsequent buffing cycles?

Are you keeping the excess residue in check?

I might suggest to play with the Ultimate Compound on the d/a. One or two test spots probably wont reveal it's true potential. Experiment with different pressures, as it relates to abrasive engagement, and pad rotation.

While m205 is extremely versatile, and capable of tremendous cutting with a microfiber pad, all things being equal (pad, tool, technique, etc), I wouldn't expect it to out perform Ultimate Compound in defect removal.

I also agree with the recommendation of some type of cutting pad. I'm not partial to the prepolymer open cell pads such as the flat or ccs lake country pads due to the amount of pressure required to engage the abrasive. I prefer to straight to softer reticulated open cell (green hex logic), or closed cell pads (yellow hex logic / lake country cyan hydrotech). That's justbme though.

[drumdan]

Regarding the cleanup of #2, I find that it's more difficult to wipe off if it's over worked.

[Ralph III]

Re: Ultimate Compound -vs- Ultra Finishing #205. Correction and finish. Input pleas

How are you preparing the pad with product?

How much product are you applying to the pad for the subsequent buffing cycles?

Are you keeping the excess residue in check?

I might suggest to play with the Ultimate Compound on the d/a. One or two test spots probably wont reveal it's true potential. Experiment with different pressures, as it relates to abrasive engagement, and pad rotation....
I also agree with the recommendation of some type of cutting pad.... That's justbme though.

Yes, I tried numerous tests spots including buffing the entire hood on my gray SUV as well as the tail end. I then buffed my entire hood on my green JD tractor as well as the tailgate on a black Chevy PU. As noted, the UC did a great job of polishing all of those surfaces out but it did little in regards to removing even minor scratches.

I was however using a polishing pad on a DA. I'm sure a cutting pad would have made a difference in it's cutting ability (why I started this thread) but nobody has yet to offer even a glimpse of possibly how much? I realize paints will react differently but could I expect a 10% to 30% increase in cutting ability with a DA cutting pad vs a DA polishing pad.

I buffed with a rotary professionally for many years and kept some really aggressive stuff on hand and yes, I used varying techniques and clean pads with adequate amounts of polish.

UC is a great product no doubt, but in this case I will be better served with a rotary and M101 (as I've decided to go with) because it will make quick work at correcting the paint in the first pass. I will then follow that up with M205 and a polishing pad via a Meguiar DA. I just got the DA though and will continue to experiment with its abilities and such as UC.

God Bless,
Ralph

[The Guz]

Re: Ultimate Compound -vs- Ultra Finishing #205. Correction and finish. Input pleas

Check out this video. There are some very good tips from Kevin Brown. Start around 4:30.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QG65GC5LOzw

If those scratches are deeper, often referred to as RIDS then you may have to live with them. Especially if it's a daily driver. If it was a concours car then you could go for that car for that perfect finish. If you get 90-95% defect removal just call it a day.

I've never used the soft buff burgundy cutting pad. I have used a lake country flat orange cutting pad with UC and it worked very well. If you are trying to isolate on those smaller scratches you should pick up some smaller pads (4" or 3").

Do you have pics of what you are working with.?

[Ralph III]

Re: Ultimate Compound -vs- Ultra Finishing #205. Correction and finish. Input pleas

Check out this video. There are some very good tips from Kevin Brown. Start around 4:30.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QG65GC5LOzw

If those scratches are deeper, often referred to as RIDS then you may have to live with them. Especially if it's a daily driver. If it was a concours car then you could go for that car for that perfect finish. If you get 90-95% defect removal just call it a day.

I've never used the soft buff burgundy cutting pad. I have used a lake country flat orange cutting pad with UC and it worked very well. If you are trying to isolate on those smaller scratches you should pick up some smaller pads (4" or 3").

Do you have pics of what you are working with.?

Thanks Guz. I watched parts of the video and had some interesting points. The great thing about when I buffed professionally out of a Dealer-only auction; was that I was working with repo's, rentals, lease cars, etc. So these were all non-personal cars. In all those years I was able to experiment with compounds and mixing such to see what best worked for me in getting the job done well but quickly.

Anyhow. This black paint is very hard so I doubt I will be able to remove all of the imperfections which isn't my goal anyhow. That would entail some serious time with wet sanding involved no doubt. My boss just wants the color and shine returned.

All of the products I used did a good job with that BUT I feel a more aggressive first step will render a much better finished product. I guess it's my perfectionists mentality coming into play. I know, with a better game plan, that he would be even more pleased with the results.

My goal would be as you essentially stated, if I can remove 75%-85% or so of these minor/moderate scratches then I will be very happy with the results. I think M101 followed up with M205 and proper pads is going to make all the difference. I should have taken some photos prior to doing anything. He is washing and following up with a fine nanoskin sponge this weekend. I demonstrated and then let him do some on Friday as he wants to help with the process. I will try and take some pics when I buff.

Ralph

[jjrakwichian]

Re: Ultimate Compound -vs- Ultra Finishing #205. Correction and finish. Input pleas

Well, best on my experiences

If using DA, I would recommend Microfiber Cutting disc all day long and by just seasoning well of an M205 on MF cutiing disc and work about 4 passes from left to right or right to left with 50% or 75% over-lap between passes and do the same thing with up and down passes you should be good. ( For me the passes from one side to side, I count as one pass, no matter how many passes from one end to another end. ) Side to side consider one pass and up to down counts as one pass as well.

[jjrakwichian]

Re: Ultimate Compound -vs- Ultra Finishing #205. Correction and finish. Input pleas

Well, best on my experiences

If using DA, I would recommend Microfiber Cutting disc all day long and by just seasoning well of an M205 on MF cutiing disc and work about 4 passes from left to right or right to left with 50% or 75% over-lap between passes and do the same thing with up and down passes you should be good. ( For me the passes from one side to side, I count as one pass, no matter how many passes from one end to another end. ) Side to side consider one pass and up to down counts as one pass as well.

[The Guz]

Re: Ultimate Compound -vs- Ultra Finishing #205. Correction and finish. Input pleas

I would agree with you to a point. The microfiber cuttings discs are more aggressive than foam. They work great on hard paint and can finish LSP ready. I would still do a test spot to see if one has to go that aggressive. Especially on soft paints.

[jjrakwichian]

Re: Ultimate Compound -vs- Ultra Finishing #205. Correction and finish. Input pleas

Yup, the test spot is always the best choice before startin paint correction process. But, the MG cutting pad and an M205 combination is too agresssive then, try this, the MG with an M205 this combination will give you a surprise finishing. This MG polishing and an M205 combination is be able to handle most of the job and really rare to bump it to the M105 or M100