• If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ by clicking the link above. You may have to register before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.

Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

"use the least aggressive product to get the job done"

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • "use the least aggressive product to get the job done"

    Thought I would bring this article by Mike Phillips back up for new members as well as some of us older guys, this can't be mentioned enough. Another reason Meguiars makes so many great products.

    "Use the least aggressive product to get the job done"

    "Use the least aggressive product to get the job done"


    I'm a strong advocate of giving due credit where credit is due for both professional and personal reasons. To this point I want to give credit to Meguiar's for this quote and philosophy, or approach towards working on automotive paints. I learned this philosophy from Meguiar's when I went to work for them in 1988 as an Outside Sales Rep and Trainer for Oregon, Washington and Idaho.

    I know they've been teaching this practice probably from their inception in 1901, that's over one hundred years. I don't want to claim anyone else's work and/orwords as my own and it's my eternal hope that others will reciprocate this basic and professional code of conduct.

    Now that I've given credit where credit is due, I would like to state that while I learned this philosophy or approach to working on paint from Meguiar's, I've never seen anything else ever written on this topic either on paper or on the Internet so let me share what it means, why it's important ... and to put this approach into practice...



    "Use the least aggressive product to get the job done"


    The reasoning and logic behind this statement and approach towards working on car paint is for two reasons.


    Reason 1 - Automotive paints are thin
    Factory applied paint whether it came on a Model T or a brand new Ford Mustang is thin, very thin, thinner than most of us prefer. It's thin because it cost more to apply more paint in the way of materials, (the paint itself), and also time, as in the time it takes to spray the paint and allow flash time in-between each coating.

    Time is money, so on an assembly line, or even in a body shop, more time means more money, for theses two reasons, cost of materials and time, paint is on a new car or paint from a body shop is thin.


    Reason 2 - Removing below surface defects means removing a little paint
    Below Surface Paint Defects are things like swirls, scratches, and etching like Type II Water Spots. Because these types of defects are below the surface level, that means they are "in" the paint, the only way to remove them is to abrade and remove a little of the surrounding paint until you level the upper most surface of the paint job until it's level with the lowest depths of the defects you're trying to remove.

    In simple words... removing swirls, scratches and etching means removing a measured amount of paint.


    Now let me tie the two concepts above together... follow me on this...

    Paint is thin, removing defects means removing paint, there's not a lot of paint available to remove.


    Starting to see the problem?


    The top coat of paint on your car, no matter what type of paint system you have, (basecoat/clearcoat or single stage), is thin so you must keep this in mind anytime you're working on it or you let someone else work on it.


    "Use the least aggressive product to get the job done"


    The reason you want to use the least aggressive product to get the job done is so that you'll leave the most amount of paint on the car to last over the service life of the car.


    Make sense?

    If you want to get deeper... this means that in order to use the least aggressive product to get the job done... you need to have more than one product in your arsenal of detailing supplies or how can you do any testing?

    If you're a detailer, or a car owner that likes to take care of your own personal cars, then you need to have more than one paint correction product in your arsenal of detailing supplies.


    Tool Time
    Products are like tools, they enable you to perform a specific procedure or task that you couldn't otherwise do. Just like a screwdriver enables you to either remover or install a screw, a quality compound or polish enables you to remove defects and restore a show car finish.

    You need some tools in your tool box!
    If you haven't already, consider adding a few tools to your tool box so anytime you're working on a car's finish you'll already have the tools you need to do some testing and then tackle the job.

    A well rounded inventory would include,

    • Aggressive Compound for serious paint defects
    • Medium Cut Polish
    • Light Cut Polish
    • Finishing Polish
    • Hand applied paint cleaner
    • Cleaner/Wax
    • Non abrasive glaze or pure polish




    Where the rubber meets the road...
    Putting the philosophy into practice means anytime you're going to work on your car or a customer's car, instead of diving right in head first with your most aggressive product, first test to see if something less aggressive will get the job done.

    You see, paint systems are different, some paint systems are more polishable or workable than others but you'll never know until you do some testing.

    I always tell my son this because it's true...

    "You don't know what you can do until you try"

    In the context of detailing, this means you don't know if you can remove the swirls with a light polish and a soft polishing pad until you try. Sure you can remove them with an aggressive compound and cutting pad but if you're goal is to preserve your car's precious, thin coat of beauty, then start each project by doing some testing and try to find the least aggressive product in your detailing arsenal that will enable you to get the job done...





    Mike Phillips
    ''USE THE LEAST AGGRESSIVE PRODUCT TO GET THE JOB DONE RIGHT''
    You Don't Know What You Can Do Until You Try '' TECHNIQUE IS EVERYTHING''
    Test Hoods Are Cheap And Most Of The Time Free

  • #2
    Number of passes

    Many thanks for refreshing this important concept!

    As a relative novice to detailing (purely for own cars), I was wondering about something along these lines:

    Is there a benefit to use a less aggressive product that eg. gets many of the swirls out on the first attempt - let's say with 6 passes (D/A), then another application with 4 passes reaches the desired result
    vs.
    using a bit more aggressive product, that does the job in 4 passes total. The latter approach obviously saves huge amount of time over the entire car, but it isn't really the "least aggressive" that gets the job done. So in summary, is there any benefit to do the first approach?

    Many thanks, Balazs

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Number of passes

      Originally posted by szladob View Post
      Many thanks for refreshing this important concept!

      As a relative novice to detailing (purely for own cars), I was wondering about something along these lines:

      Is there a benefit to use a less aggressive product that eg. gets many of the swirls out on the first attempt - let's say with 6 passes (D/A), then another application with 4 passes reaches the desired result
      vs.
      using a bit more aggressive product, that does the job in 4 passes total. The latter approach obviously saves huge amount of time over the entire car, but it isn't really the "least aggressive" that gets the job done. So in summary, is there any benefit to do the first approach?

      Many thanks, Balazs
      Hey Balazs

      The article below should help you understand why to use the least aggressive product first and see why it's so IMPORTANT!
      Went and found this article also by Mike Phillips, here you go.

      Film-Build
      Automotive paints in general, tend to be very thin. The most crucial and deciding factor that will determine your ability to successfully remove a below surface defect from any automotive paint is the thickness (film-build) of the paint. Because you have limited amount of film-build that you can safely remove, the depth of a scratch you can safely remove is limited. Simply put, you don’t have a lot of room for error when removing defects, (removing paint), from the finish on your car’s painted panels. Paint is thin, we’re talking anywhere from 2 mils (.002 inch) to 8 mils thick.

      The word thick as it is used to describe the film-build of your car’s finish is a little misleading. A better word would be thin, because the film-build on your car is anywhere from 2 to 8 mils thin. As a relative comparison, the average business card has a thickness of about 12 mil, whereas standard copy paper is about 3.5 mils.

      The typical new car has a paint coating that’s 6 to 8 mils thin. Film build includes the entire film-build, not just the working film-build of the topcoat. The working film-build averages around 2 mils thin but can be thinner. Are you starting to get the idea here? Paint is thin!

      Most professionals and serious car enthusiasts use a rotary buffer to remove paint defects. With good polishes and the right buffing pad, the rotary buffer makes paint defect removal easy, except on single stage white paint. The reason for this is that the rotary buffers creates heat between the pad and the paint surface. If heat build-up becomes excessive, you can burn the paint. The hardness of white paint requires more pad pressure, which creates more heat and increases the chances of burning the paint.

      Also read this great article, it also can show you that pads, products, speed, pressures and machine all plays a big roll in least to aggressive in the manner they are used.

      Have any more questions fill free to post them we will help you get the hang of it!, there's more to this then applying wax
      Check these articles out

      And these video's to get you started.


      Hope I've help!
      ''USE THE LEAST AGGRESSIVE PRODUCT TO GET THE JOB DONE RIGHT''
      You Don't Know What You Can Do Until You Try '' TECHNIQUE IS EVERYTHING''
      Test Hoods Are Cheap And Most Of The Time Free

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Number of passes

        Hi stang_krazy,

        Thanks for your post; I do appreciate how thin the paint is; however I am not sure it answered my question... Since in my two approaches that I have listed, I presume we are removing roughly the same amount of paint...

        So my question still remains; use the least aggressive product that gets the job done, or use the least aggressive product that gets the job done quick enough...

        Thanks anyhow, Balazs

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Number of passes

          Originally posted by szladob View Post
          Hi stang_krazy,

          Thanks for your post; I do appreciate how thin the paint is; however I am not sure it answered my question... Since in my two approaches that I have listed, I presume we are removing roughly the same amount of paint...

          So my question still remains; use the least aggressive product that gets the job done, or use the least aggressive product that gets the job done quick enough...

          Thanks anyhow, Balazs
          Hey Balazs, It's not hard at all.

          That's another reason for doing a test spot, to find out the least aggressive product to get the job done. If it takes 4 application with product A and you doing 3 cover passes to remove a scratch then OK if you don't want t spend that much time and your going to be doing the whole vehicle then of course go up in aggressiveness to the next product in line and see if it can do the job in just a couple applications. If it takes to many and your technique is right then move up again. The importance of a test spot, to get your plan of attack down so you don't waste time .

          Hope that helped
          ''USE THE LEAST AGGRESSIVE PRODUCT TO GET THE JOB DONE RIGHT''
          You Don't Know What You Can Do Until You Try '' TECHNIQUE IS EVERYTHING''
          Test Hoods Are Cheap And Most Of The Time Free

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: "use the least aggressive product to get the job done"

            yes, dont do the whole car with a mild product to find it didn't work.

            also, don't do every single strength of product. having a mild cleaner polish, like UP or 205, than a strong one like UC is usually sufficient.
            2017 Subaru WRX Premium - WR Blue

            Comment

            Your Privacy Choices
            Working...
            X