A slightly less than simple regimen: wash, sealant & wax ?

[s word]

Re: A slightly less than simple regimen: wash, sealant & wax ?

With regards to your question about how to tell when your sealant/wax is gone or when it's time to re-apply wax, there is a technique known as the "Squeak Test":

http://www.meguiarsonline.com/forums...ence-of-wax&s=

Thanks Davey I never knew of this test. Does it work all the time or can there be certain products which this would not work? Also because of various wear patterns on the car is this typically performed in multiple spots or just the usual on hood test?

[Murr1525]

Re: A slightly less than simple regimen: wash, sealant & wax ?

I've never gotten it to work...

[ffboy]

Re: A slightly less than simple regimen: wash, sealant & wax ?

Squeak test is one of the "older" methods of detrmining the presence of wax, if I'm not mistaken. It is a bit scary to do that, if done wrong can inflict scratches/swirls. I prefer to use a quick detailer to determine if I need to rewax. I feel it's a safer way of checking whether or not I need to rewax.

[davey g-force]

Re: A slightly less than simple regimen: wash, sealant & wax ?

Thanks Davey I never knew of this test. Does it work all the time or can there be certain products which this would not work? Also because of various wear patterns on the car is this typically performed in multiple spots or just the usual on hood test?

As far as I know, it works for all products. I certainly have used it successfully to test for the presence of M21.

I just do it in a couple of spots: one on the hood, one on the roof and one on the trunk. I'll only do it after I've performed a traditional bucket wash though, which is not that often these days..

[davey g-force]

Re: A slightly less than simple regimen: wash, sealant & wax ?

I prefer to use a quick detailer to determine if I need to rewax. I feel it's a safer way of checking whether or not I need to rewax.

Please explain?

Do you mean you mean you judge it by how easy the QD is to apply/remove?

[ffboy]

Re: A slightly less than simple regimen: wash, sealant & wax ?

Please explain?

Do you mean you mean you judge it by how easy the QD is to apply/remove?

Yes, accdg to training videos here at meguiars regarding the use of UQD and UQW, and even in the instructions of Showtime instant detailer. It states that apply wax when showtime becomes more difficult to remove. Seems to work for me, I've used it on different quick detailers (Megs UQD amd Last Touch, Mothers, Eagle One). Most of them feel a bit difficult to remove or become difficult to spread evenly.

[Murr1525]

Re: A slightly less than simple regimen: wash, sealant & wax ?

Yeah, spray waxes and QD become harder to spread, remove as the base coat of wax goes away.

[goldenlight]

Re: A slightly less than simple regimen: wash, sealant & wax ?

I'm actually considering topping Gold Class over the Ultimate Wax. I'm guessing you would apply the Ultimate Wax every 3-4 months and the Gold Class every 1-1.5 months.
I'm no expert


Here are some indicators it time to re apply wax.

1) Water does not Sheet Well (Early indicator)
2) Car is becoming harder to dry. (Caution)
3)water beading is completely gone. (Wax Immediately)

[Michael Stoops]

Re: A slightly less than simple regimen: wash, sealant & wax ?

I heard back from Meguairs directly -- by phone and email.

And we provided a detailed response at the top of page 2 in this thread, as well.

It turns out that "Ultimate Wax" is simply *marketed* as a wax. It is not, in fact, a wax.

Very true, but that's because to the average consumer shopping at a major retail outlet, the terms "sealant" and "wax" can be very confusing. We often hear people say "I just applied a sealant, now what wax do I need?" when, in fact, they don't need a wax once a sealant is applied. And for those who have never heard the term "sealant", well, they won't even look at a product unless it's a "wax" because they're looking for a wax. And that's because, in their mind, a wax is the product they want to add gloss and protection to their paint.

It is, rather, Meguiars' "most recent, and longest lasting sealant". And that includes their current Professional line.

All very true, but don't get hung up on the "Professional" aspect of our Professional Line. All that means is those products are geared toward the professional body shop industry, for the most part, and not that those products are in any way "better than" or "superior to" our consumer line. This is a common misconception, but far from true. There are plenty of products in our Pro Line that we would never recommend to a consumer who is working by hand or with a DA, since these particular products are designed for rotary use only. Many also date back to when all paints were single stage lacquers and therefor much more forgiving than today's catalyzed clear coats. They're still perfectly fine products, but just not the best choice on a newer vehicle.

And they contradict the "both do the same thing" advice, above. Well, more the 'how' ... and that the sealant's a much more durable protection than a wax.

That's not a contradiction at all. Waxes and sealants are both designed to do the exact same thing - protect the gloss created by the prep steps (claying and compounding/polishing) and to act as a sacrificial barrier against industrial fallout and the effects of the elements. But sealants, as a group, will be more durable than more traditional carnauba waxes, as a group, will be. This is true whether talking about our sealants vs waxes or anyone else's sealants vs waxes. That's all down to chemistry, specifically that synthetic sealants work by cross linking of the polymer chains as they cure, while carnauba waxes tend to be more of simple layer on top of the paint. That oversimplifies things a bit as nobody makes a truly "pure carnauba wax" in the sense of the product being nothing but carnuaba in the bottle or can. Such a product would be unusable since pure carnauba is amost as hard as a rock, so to make it usable as a car wax it needs to blended with other things, including solvents and potentially some other polymers, silicones, oils, etc. So anyone making a claim of "100% carnauba wax" is really saying that their product contains no monton wax, paraffin wax, bees wax, etc. But the product is not 100% comprised of carnauba, just that 100% of the wax is carnauba, but that could be almost any percentage of the overall mix. But there was no contradiction about the fact that sealants and waxes are designed to do the exact same thing.

In any case, they do NOT recommend layering sealants of different types.

That's more of an indication that there's nothing to gain by applying one sealant on top of another, just like there's no real benefit to applying one carnauba on top of another. You won't hurt anything, and bonding will still happen (at least to some degree), but the whole concept of layering is, to us anyway, nonsense. We have never, ever seen anyone prove definitively that you can create an ever increasing film thickness by applying layer upon layer of synthetic sealant to the paint. In fact, more evidence exists to prove that a law of diminishing returns exists and you will actually start to remove some of the protection laid down by constantly rubbing the surface, both through application and removal of subsequent product.

They DO say that while one coat is sufficient, up to TWO coats can be applied. Ideally, applied thinly, and with 12-24 hr. cure between the coats.

We always recommend applying two coats, just to ensure uniform coverage and appearance. This is because, when properly applied - meaning very thin - it can actually be difficult to see where you've applied the wax/sealant or if you missed a spot. The lighter the color of the paint, the more difficult the applied wax is to see. But this has nothing at all to do with so called layering.

That sealant coat is where the 'long lasting' protection comes from.

Absolutely, for the reason stated above that sealants last longer than carnauba waxes do.

For pure cosmetics, an actual wax -- e.g. GoldClass Liquid -- can be applied, but will not necessarily improve the water/dirt/UV performance w.r.t. the Sealant.

Spot on. And it's the main reason people who use carnauba over a sealant do so in the first place. But if you've applied a hydrophobic polymer like Ultimate Wax, do you really want to compromise that effect by putting a more traditional carnauba over it? Or are looks more important? It's a very personal choice, really, and there is no wrong answer here.

On another note, a chemical-only wash that works for me for sealant/wax removal & finish prep prior to even clay/compound/polish is a regular bucket of Meguiars GoldClass wash with ~1-2 oz. of ChemicalGuys Nonsense. I find Nonsense to be an effeictive, useful, and concentrated APC that's got benefits of near neutral pH, no colorants, and no harsh odors. Meguiars' APC+ I found to be to harsh for my own interests/use.

That's fine - we all like what we like for a wide variety of reasons. If you really want to strip your wax, for whatever reason, and are looking for a very safe and effective way to do so, our APC diluted 10:1 with water and used as a wash is highly effective, but so is our D114 Rinse Free Express wash used in a heavy concentration (like 6:1 in a spray bottle) or, like some guys we know do, mix up a 32 ounce bottle with 4 ounces of D114, 4 ounces of isopropyl alcohol and top off with water. This can then be used as a wipe when compounding to make sure you're not leaving any oils behind that are filling defects so that you can fully remove them, or to remove any finishing polish oils before applying one of the new highly durable coatings (Opt-Coat, C-Quartz, or our own M188 sold in Asia only) since a totally clean surface is mandatory before applying these. But the same mix can be used for stripping an older application of wax or sealant that has pretty well degraded anyway.