A question?

[PhantomMagician]

Re: A question?

I've told you that he can't, or don't know what swirl marks are..

Just a suggestion, why don't you, instead of debating here, Just go and attending some meguiar's classes... there will be great teacher to teach...

Wax with no abrasive cannot cause swirl mark of course, but the PERSON who applied the wax, absolutely CAN ... with wrong technique or dirty or wrong pad...

Even a TINY dust on your car while applying wax can and will cause swirl mark when applied in a wrong way...

You have only heard one of million time ? then DON'T just hear , do some research, try this and than, learn and observe from other people whether they are just rokiee or professional..

If you only HEARD one out of million, I had seen with my OWN eyes at least 4 out of 10 that applying wax the wrong way or not do further inspection before proceed to wax CAN and WILL cause swirl...

and last, for your question " where are the swirl ? "
They are sitting in front of you, you just don't see it, when almost everybody here see them...

now, the question is.. Why almost everybody here can see it and you don't ? is it because everybody here are wrong , and you are the only one who right ? wow, what a very good confident you have there... maybe you should open your own detailing class.. maybe the great Mr. Mike Phillip him self will attend Mr.Genius class...

[gsx62391]

Re: A question?

Now i watched your jeep video and i did see a few on the hood by the window around 5:37 time frame but you move so fast and you are like an inch away from the paint and the camera is out of focus the whole video that its hard to see anything. But you did also state that you dont need a paint correction on it cause you have treated it from new. That makes sense. But i believe that you are under the assumption that most detailers paint correct every car we touch. That is incorrect. I very rarely get a brand new car to detail. The few that i get is because they want to protect the finish and that is when a good wash and a paint sealant is applied. But on probably 80% if not more of the cars that i come across is because the want to restore the paint. In those situations where you get a new customer with a paint finish that is already damaged and swirled explain your process for that please.

[Mike Bones]

Re: A question?

Quote:

Todd's post clearly says that the reason swirls were induced on that BMW, was because of how it was applied i.e. Dirty rag to apply wax, dirty towel to buff off.


Since Todd was not there, that is pure assumption on Todd's part. Was the BMW
swirled before the waxing? No. Wax does not cause swirl marks! I have only heard that one a million times also. Once again, it is pure assumption that a dirty rag was used and caused the scratches.

It clearly states the waxing and washing were by hand.It is not likely that a dirty rag
could have produced these scratches into the clear coat.


Quote:

The red IS-F is cleary swirled on the trunk from a similar wash method. Just look at the video. Stop it at 2:10-15. The clear is all swirled because of a wash technique.

You are wrong . Why ? Because in that video the red lexus had been treated with the
product. Also, if my wash technique is the reason for the swirls on the trunk, then why does the rest of the car not show the same thing? Lastly, where are the swirls
on the jeep and tahoe? I show the washing with Dawn soap, so where are the swirls
if the washing technique is the reason?

Bill... Clearly I'm NOT WRONG. It's been pointed out on numerous occasions that IS-F trunk is all swirled to hell. Just because you've treated the trunk with snake... Um "the product"... does not mean there are no swirl marks. I also find it funny how the light hits the car just right and your camera hand speed went into maximum warp. Man, you are hilarious.

[billd55]

Re: A question?

Quote:

We know that Dawn will remove any wax on the car but we also know that it cannot remove a polymer sealant, acrylic, or PTFE.


Clearly, you do not. As I have said far too many times you are comparing apples with oranges. Dawn will not remove this product. Many of you continue to make these statements as fact, but it is just your assumption.

This car was waxed. You say it was to cover up damage from a washing which is
pure assumption. I washed the Jeep and Tahoe with Dawn in the sunlight, and no swirls. The jeep was filmed in direct sunlight. Look at the hood? How could I hide
them if they were there?

You are all fixed on one area of one video to make your point, but there are 3 other cars you virtually ignore. I really do not know how much clearer I could film this to show
that there are no swirls.


It seems you are the ones arguing with me. You ask questions or make statements, and if I respond back I am arguing with you. It seems you want me to agree with you, but that is not the purpose of a forum.

[gsx62391]

Re: A question?

ok Bill, i just went outside and did a quick video of my neighbors dirty *** van. Just to help with the way your filming. The van is a 2007, never paint corrected, never protected, never even waxed. It hasn't been washed in a couple of weeks. I even borrowed a cheap camera and lowered the resolution to its lowest to try to mimic the best i could to your videos.
In order to reveal the swirls to the naked eye, you must find the source of light through the reflection of the paint, and then track that glare across the finish. If you hide the light source then it hides the swirls. Also try to have the reflection that you are tracking on a flat surface not any angled surfaces because you want the light to refract off the surface directly into your eye, not all over the place. do a video where you are purposely tracking the light source in an attempt to actually try to find the swirl and then we can better evaluate the performance of this product. here is the link to the video i just made.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gRJvmM24nAw

[Mike Bones]

Re: A question?

I want to see links to the Tahoe and Jeep. How about ones to the plane and boats, as well?

Todd had a nice post on how he detailed a Bugatti Veyron SS, right here on MOL and easy to find.

[gsx62391]

Re: A question?

Quote:

We know that Dawn will remove any wax on the car but we also know that it cannot remove a polymer sealant, acrylic, or PTFE.


Clearly, you do not. As I have said far too many times you are comparing apples with oranges. Dawn will not remove this product. Many of you continue to make these statements as fact, but it is just your assumption.

Go back and read what i just said that you quoted of mine. It says i know that dawn will remove a wax but it wont remove this product. Try to actually read the post before getting all offensive first.

[billd55]

Re: A question?

Quote:

Um "the product"... does not mean there are no swirl marks. I also find it funny how the light hits the car just right and your camera hand speed went into maximum warp. Man, you are hilarious.


Mike what do you want me to say? You find one angle on four videos, and say I did
not spend enough time showing you that certain spot.

Quote:

Just because you've treated the trunk with snake... Um "the product"... does not mean there are no swirl marks

Now it is snake oil . I can see you have a real open mind to new things. Why is it
you treat the rest of the other videos as a snake and run away from them?

[billd55]

Re: A question?

Quote:

We know that Dawn will remove any wax on the car but we also know that it cannot remove a polymer sealant, acrylic, or PTFE.

Sorry for my mistake! I'm getting a little sloppy in my writing.

[gsx62391]

Re: A question?

Quote:

We know that Dawn will remove any wax on the car but we also know that it cannot remove a polymer sealant, acrylic, or PTFE.

Sorry for my mistake! I'm getting a little sloppy in my writing.

Understandable

[Mike Bones]

Re: A question?

Sorry, not only was it the Lexus, but the Benz had swirls on the hood too. Forgot to mention that... You're right, I had to find more evidence to debunk you further. I'm a noob, what do I know?

I'm very open minded, in fact, I think Opti-coat 2.0 and Cquartz are great products. Proven as well. But where's YOUR proof, Bill! The PROOF! Lol! I watched the Tahoe vid. Why didn't you show the application and process of "the product" as you say you're trying to educate us with something new? Cquartz has a nice video about their product, and by the way I believe their coating only needs to be renewed once every 2 years.

[3Fitty]

Re: A question?

I don't think I or anyone else is being hard on Bill, nor disrespecting his opinion but you have to look at the substance of what he is saying and WHERE he is writing it.

This is MOL, they have a philosophy here. One thing they teach is that good washing techniques can limit new swirls in your paint. I believe they would agree that even if you had their best sealant/wax on your car and washed with poor habits, you probably would continue to instill new swirls.

Bill says no. His new supercoating, bond to the paint, magic doodle, prevents all swirls. As evidence, he offers some video of some heavily swirled cars as proof.

Further, what he is asking forum members to believe is that people like:

Kevin Brown
Mike Pennington
Michael Stoops
Todd Helme
Mike Phillips
David Fermani
Chad Raskovic
Chris Dasher
Joe (Superior Shine)
Meguiars (as a company)
Menzerna (as a company)
Poorboys (as a company)
Mother's (as a company)
Turtle Wax (as a company)
Simoniz (as a company)
etc....

Are all wrong, but he is right.

This is not exactly "the world is round" type of argument. Take Bill's product (but get him to send you a sample so as not to support gorilla style marketing), dump some sand in a bucket with no grit guard. At soap, mix thoroughly and wash your car. Make sure your car is swirl free before you start.

Examine the paint after the wash. Is your car still swirl free? My bet is no. I think *most* pros would agree with me.

Who has enough confidence in Bill's product to give it a try?

[3Fitty]

Re: A question?

Oh, one last thing...

If I applied Meguiars Ultimate wax every month for 5 years, it would last five years as well. In fact, if I did it for 10 years, it would last 10 years... and so on...

So, I guess we can say Meguiars offers a wax that lasts 50 years, if used correctly!!! Well done Meguiars!

[billd55]

Re: A question?

Actually the benz has scratches , and are not swirls. This car had them
when I did it . I meant the two lexus cars,jeep, and tahoe that were done when new.

Quote:

I'm very open minded, in fact, I think Opti-coat 2.0 and Cquartz are great products. Proven as well. But where's YOUR proof, Bill! The PROOF! Lol! I watched the Tahoe vid. Why didn't you show the application and process of "the product" as you say you're trying to educate us with something new?


Mike, I do not work for GEM Indusrtries, and those products you mention are not waxes or polysealants. They maybe great products. Since I work by myself ,I cannot
film how I apply the product on film.

I am a detailer who has used this product since 1993,Opti-Coat nor Cquartz cannot claim that they have been around that long.AT-5 is not well known, or promoted well
IMO. Although, it is priced well. At $50.00/gallon, and 3-4 ozs are required per car ,
it makes sense when you do detailing for a business.

Also these products are not well suited for fiberglass boats, and our better suited to be applied in a enclosed structure. That is not the case with AT-5. Also, I mention
that the product should be applied once a year, but that could be extended. The 5
means years, but I feel 1 year is a good time frame.

Opti-Coat cannot be applied over itself, maybe CQuartz can.
AT-5 is no problem at all, and can be removed with a wax remover product.
The others are not as easy.

Quote:

But where's YOUR proof, Bill! The PROOF! Lol!

I thought the videos would indicate that , but if you want more. This is a website
of a company I worked with in Houston Tx. They took AT-5 and changed a few things to comply for application on commercial jets, and jacked up the price.

They did extensive and expensive tests that show what this product can do. Here is there website:

http://logisticlean.com

[billd55]

Re: A question?

Quote:

This is not exactly "the world is round" type of argument. Take Bill's product (but get him to send you a sample so as not to support gorilla style marketing), dump some sand in a bucket with no grit guard. At soap, mix thoroughly and wash your car. Make sure your car is swirl free before you start.

Do you think that is a fair test to dump sand in the bucket? I do not. What I would
suggest is taking Dawn soap from bottle, and pouring it on a wash mit. Wet the vehicle ,and scrub the paint to clean it.