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A warning on "paint wrinkle"!!!

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  • A warning on "paint wrinkle"!!!

    This thread was created to warn others detailers, novice, experienced, and even the pros.

    So I was working on a new Honda Element last Sunday, only very minor correction needed. The plan of attack was to use M205 via the Flex and a polishing pad. There was however a few RIDS that needed M105 and the rotary. The front of the car also had some sort of white over spray on it and since I had my rotary out I thought I’d try and remove what the clay had not. I was running my Makita on a speed of 2 with M105 and a PFW pad. I applied medium pressure and with in seconds the paint wrinkled!!!

    Yes, even someone with 20 years experience running a rotary can mess up now and then…just ***** it happened to me.

    I’m really kicking myself in the butt over this one because I had seen the warnings in threads before about this so called “paint wrinkle”, which can occur when polishing plastic bumpers with a rotary buffer. I honestly didn’t give it too much thought since I have been doing this for so long and have never had it happen to me before.

    In talking with others it seems that the flex agent added to the paint for plastic pieces, makes them much more susceptible to paint wrinkle. I’d more inclined to say it’s more of a problem on the newer cars, since I’ve never had this happen before, but I really can’t say for sure…paint really has been changing a lot over the years as the EPA clamps down on auto manufacturers.

    For those who are wondering, I dropped the vehicle off this morning to have the bumper cover repainted, and the owner should have it back sometime tomorrow. My father works for one of the elite body shops in the twin cities, so the car will definitely be in good hands.

    I’d also like to say that the owner has been very understanding with this whole deal, which definitely makes things a little easier on me. I also feel better knowing I haven’t lost his business and that he still wants me to do his wife’s car and has also referred me to some others.



    Pic of the paint wrinkle…
    Rasky's Auto Detailing

  • #2
    Re: A warning on "paint wrinkle"!!!

    Sorry that happened. However it is a very good warning. It can happen to anyone. Thanks again for the heads up.
    quality creates its own demand

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: A warning on "paint wrinkle"!!!

      Wow, that's crazy!

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: A warning on "paint wrinkle"!!!

        Exactly what Michael Stoops alluded to in another thread. Different substrates and materials to consider when using a rotary to polish vehicles. If it can happen to a 20 year pro like Rasky, it can certainly happen to any of us. Rasky, do you think this could happen using a DA?

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: A warning on "paint wrinkle"!!!

          Originally posted by ClearlyCoated View Post
          Exactly what Michael Stoops alluded to in another thread. Different substrates and materials to consider when using a rotary to polish vehicles. If it can happen to a 20 year pro like Rasky, it can certainly happen to any of us. Rasky, do you think this could happen using a DA?
          I guess so....
          Hello, I have been doing a regular wash and wax since I owned the car (Bought in July 05). Never done a full detail. Finally did it today. I dont have any before pics. Process: Wash: (KIT Carnuba Wash) Clay: Mothers (Even though car is 2 years old, clay didnt pick up much debris, surface...
          Rasky's Auto Detailing

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: A warning on "paint wrinkle"!!!

            These are the kinds of things nobody thinks about when working by hand or with a G110, but you had better be aware of when using a rotary. Yes, the flex agent in the paint can cause it to respond differently to the same input, but so can the way the different substrate beneath the paint dissipates heat.

            Rasky, we're really sorry to see this happen to you, but we very much appreciate a seasoned pro having the guts to freely post this for all to see. It's one thing to make a mistake, another to have to pay for it, but something different still to volunteer it in front of everyone and say "D'oh!!"

            It is guys like you that help others learn. Thank you.
            Michael Stoops
            Senior Global Product & Training Specialist | Meguiar's Inc.

            Remember, this hobby is supposed to be your therapy, not the reason you need therapy.

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: A warning on "paint wrinkle"!!!

              Originally posted by Michael Stoops View Post
              These are the kinds of things nobody thinks about when working by hand or with a G110, but you had better be aware of when using a rotary. Yes, the flex agent in the paint can cause it to respond differently to the same input, but so can the way the different substrate beneath the paint dissipates heat.

              Rasky, we're really sorry to see this happen to you, but we very much appreciate a seasoned pro having the guts to freely post this for all to see. It's one thing to make a mistake, another to have to pay for it, but something different still to volunteer it in front of everyone and say "D'oh!!"

              It is guys like you that help others learn. Thank you.
              Thanks Mike! I definitely agree that the plastics inability to dissipate heat had something to do with it.


              I was really debating whether or not to post this but after talking with Tim Lingor, since it was his post I had seen long ago about the issue, and a few others, I decided it was the right thing to do.
              Rasky's Auto Detailing

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: A warning on "paint wrinkle"!!!

                VERY helpful post! It's been told to us a couple of times on MOL. I seem to remember a post from KerrinJeff, regarding a Honda bumper that gave his team trouble too.

                A wool pad at 1100RPM wouldn't of caused that much heat into the paint? I bet a DA at Speed 5 with a polishing pad would have done the same to that paint area.

                I have much more respect for a detailer that will show his good details and show troubles he/she has encountered too! This helps _everyone_ on the forums.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: A warning on "paint wrinkle"!!!

                  Originally posted by RaskyR1 View Post
                  In the case the user almost certainly used really bad technique to cause such a problem - unless there was truly an issue with the paint. But we've seen people do all the serious no-no's at once with a D/A - cutting pad, speed 6, compound, all the pressure they could muster, and then dwell on one spot for a few minutes. All of this goes 100% against what we teach. Looks as though that unfortunate soul didn't even use the most aggressive products and he still ran into trouble, but he never did come clean on just aggressive he was.

                  The big difference with a rotary is that this sort of thing can happen very quickly with only a slight loss of attention.
                  Michael Stoops
                  Senior Global Product & Training Specialist | Meguiar's Inc.

                  Remember, this hobby is supposed to be your therapy, not the reason you need therapy.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: A warning on "paint wrinkle"!!!

                    Sorry to see that happen, but glad to hear your customer was understanding and wants to continue business with you. That shows that you conduct yourself like a responsible and true professional. Thanks for the heads up.
                    Jesse

                    2009-2014 Meguiar's/Car Crazy SEMA Team
                    www.ShineTechAutoDetail.com
                    Facebook www.detailing.com

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: A warning on "paint wrinkle"!!!

                      Sorry to hear that Rasky!!

                      Question: Did some of the paint chip off in paint wrinkling like in your picture?

                      But good thing you have connections and that the owner still likes you.
                      Keep Up the Great Work!!
                      Joel
                      Firefighter/EMT-B
                      Rejuvenation Auto Detailing
                      "Satisfaction Guaranteed or Your Dirt Back!!!"
                      '99 F-150

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: A warning on "paint wrinkle"!!!

                        Originally posted by Carfire View Post
                        Sorry to hear that Rasky!!

                        Question: Did some of the paint chip off in paint wrinkling like in your picture?

                        But good thing you have connections and that the owner still likes you.
                        Keep Up the Great Work!!
                        Yeah, I'm guess it wrinkled up and then the pad was still spinning over the area causing it to flake or chip off.

                        Yes it does. I will only have to pay for materials and the labor for the painter. my father offered to remove, prep, and reinstall the bumper for free....by free I mean I will be detailing his car or something in return soon.
                        Rasky's Auto Detailing

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: A warning on "paint wrinkle"!!!

                          I think the operative word is "learning". I am guessing you have put a lot of that into your work over the years based on the support you are getting from you client. Hard competitive attention-to-detail work means always pushing your limits. Mistakes happen. I don't feel so bad now about waxing my new car with rubbing compound back in the 60's.
                          Success is never final, failure is never fatal. It's courage that counts.
                          by John Wooden

                          '88 Honda

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: A warning on "paint wrinkle"!!!

                            Whoa.....I'm detailing a jaguar with rubber (or some non-metal) bumpers this weekend. Think I'll go extra slow.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: A warning on "paint wrinkle"!!!

                              Same exact thing happened to me, also on a Honda, except using the PC with 4" cutting pad.

                              Comment

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