PC7424 + SONUS Pads + D151 = No Go :(

[Dmitriy15]

PC7424
Sonus: Oragen, Green, Blue pad.
D151

Serrious swirls on 03 Nissan Maxima....

Orange Cutting Pad
1)Used good amount but not too much product.
2) Spread by hand and work it in at Speed 2 and finish off at 4 with 15 pounds of pressure. Did NOT let it dry so zero dusting.
Most swirls not removes, more serrious scratches are filled in and look better but swirls still there. In fact looks like they are lighter but there is more of them now.

3)Followed same technique with Green Polishing pad.

4) Finished with Blue buffing pad.

I rewash pads and make sure they are sqeeky clean.
Second attempt on my Honda S2000 hood good amount of swirls.

SAME RESULTS they seem like they not as deep but more of them.


Should I work the product at 5 and 6 speeds? Am I not being aggressive enogh?

[Sal329]

Re: PC7424 + SONUS Pads + D151 = No Go

WHat size pads? I would try it again speed 5. I used 151 on a white mazda 6 speed 5 some areas speed 6 with LC 5.5" white and orange pads

[RamAirV1]

Re: PC7424 + SONUS Pads + D151 = No Go

PC7424
Sonus: Oragen, Green, Blue pad.
D151

Serrious swirls on 03 Nissan Maxima....

Orange Cutting Pad
1)Used good amount but not too much product.
2) Spread by hand and work it in at Speed 2 and finish off at 4 with 15 pounds of pressure. Did NOT let it dry so zero dusting.
Most swirls not removes, more serrious scratches are filled in and look better but swirls still there. In fact looks like they are lighter but there is more of them now.

3)Followed same technique with Green Polishing pad.

4) Finished with Blue buffing pad.

I rewash pads and make sure they are sqeeky clean.
Second attempt on my Honda S2000 hood good amount of swirls.

SAME RESULTS they seem like they not as deep but more of them.


Should I work the product at 5 and 6 speeds? Am I not being aggressive enogh?

I had a similar experience with the orange Sonus pad. I fixed it with #80 on a yellow Meguiars polishing pad.

RamAirV1

[Markus Kleis]

Re: PC7424 + SONUS Pads + D151 = No Go

IME the orange sonus pad is BRUTAL on paint. Not a fan...it won't touch anything of mine or a clients.

[Mike Phillips]

Re: PC7424 + SONUS Pads + D151 = No Go

With a Porter Cable polisher, at speed 4, pushing down with 15 lbs of pressure, the pad is not going to rotate, at least not very well. If you tip the polisher just a little and put too much pressure on just one edge of the pad, (buffing crooked), this to will stop the pad from rotating at that speed. Edges, curves, bodylines, etc., any raised portion of a panel, if you buff over it this increased pressure to a small area of the face of the foam pad will also act to stop it from rotating.

If you foam pad starts to become wet, at speed 4.0 you pad, especially under pressure and certainly around any high points will stop rotating.

When the pad isn't rotating, if you pay attention it basically is vibrating, that is the polisher is running but at the surface level where the face of the foam pad in against the paint, it looks as though it's for the most part just vibrating, not really oscillating although at some level there is likely some of this taking place.

The point is, in order to remove swirls which are a below surface defect, you need to remove the paint surrounding them until the surface is as much as possible, completely flat.

Here's the tie-in...

DA Polishers remove paint best when the pad is rotating or spinning over the paint, not just vibrating against it.

FWIW, my experience with most foam cutting pads on the market is that while they will remove swirls and scratches they will tend to be aggressive enough that the foam itself can haze the paint. To seasoned and skilled person they know they can then remove the haze by using a less aggressive product with a less aggressive polish.

Problem is sometimes people new to machine cleaning and polishing kind of panic when after doing a cleaning process they inspect the paint and find it doesn't look better and in some cases might look worse.

Some clear coat paint swirl and scratch easy and when that's the case it makes working on them a lot more difficult even for seasoned pros.

Also keep in mind that D151 is a cleaner/wax, not a cleaner/polish, paint cleaner or compound, it's definitely limited as to what it can do.

It's actually not for enthusiasts wanting a flawless finish its for production detailers and detail shops to enable them to clean, polish and protect the paint in one step with the primary focus on making clean, shiny paint, not swirl free finishes.

So part of the problem is that you might not have the right product for the job. Maybe looking into getting any of the below,

M83 Dual Action Cleaner/Polish
M80 Speed Glaze
M02 Fine Cut Cleaner - Make sure it says on the back that you can use it with a DA Polisher as there's an older formula still around that will say for use with a rotary buffer only.


Read through this, the top part lists all the common mistakes which mostly apply to the Porter Cable unit as our G110 offers quite a bit more power and rotating power is less of an issue. The bottom portion shares some tips and techniques to correct any problems.

Tips & Techniques for using the G110, G100, G220 and the PC Dual Action Polisher


Then when you get ready to work on your car again, only do a test spot, that is work a small section with ALL the products and pads you plan on using and do the whole process to this one small area and make sure you can mane one small area look good before you try to buff out the entire car.


Here's some information on D151

D151 Paint Reconditioning Cream

Note this in the second post,

Directions: Shake well. Work one section at a time. Always work on cool paint surface.

Step 1: Machine Application

D.A. Polisher:
Choose appropriate Meguiar’s buffing pad. Set machine at medium speed setting of 3-4. Begin working P.R.C. in a 2’x2’ area with overlapping passes. Continue working until defects are removed and high gloss is achieved. Wipe residue with Meguiar’s Ultimate Wipe Detailing Cloth.

Hope that helps...

[Ryan L.]

Re: PC7424 + SONUS Pads + D151 = No Go

I'm working with D151 on my moms Odyssey right now and pressure and speed is everything with this product in my opinion. My test spot was D151 on a W8006 with DA at Speed 4 and about 10lbs of pressure. Made the paint shiny and removed some swirls/haze on the paint but not some of the RIDS. Moved up to speed 5 and about 15lbs of pressure on a different spot and right away great results.

Also this product has a super long work time, so use that to your advantage. What I am doing now it starting at speed 5 and 15lbs for about a minute then moving down to speed 4 and 10lbs four another minute.

Ryan

[Maserati Mario]

Re: PC7424 + SONUS Pads + D151 = No Go

151 for removing scratches? Wouldn't you use 105?

[Ryan L.]

Re: PC7424 + SONUS Pads + D151 = No Go

151 for removing scratches? Wouldn't you use 105?

In theory yes...but whatever pad and/or machine combo I used with M105, I got some slight hazing. With my tests spots with D151, it removed almost everything besides some deeper RIDS, which I was perfectly fine with. Its a daily driver mini-van that sees a lot of highway miles, so I'm not going for a swirl free show room shine. I could wash it once a month and it would still look better than every mini-van in San Diego.

And I really didn't want to have to do 2 steps on it either, its a daily driver.

Ryan

[Dmitriy15]

Re: PC7424 + SONUS Pads + D151 = No Go

Thank you for feedback, I will keep yall posted. I might have to get a test panel and practice on that in the basement, temps are getting below 60. Working outside ***** now. haha

[Justin Murphy]

Re: PC7424 + SONUS Pads + D151 = No Go

151 for removing scratches? Wouldn't you use 105?

Once again, it's what you want to accomplish.
Shiny paint with some defect removal and protection.......
D151

Perfect paint aka swirl free.....
Test area with least aggressive chemical/pad.
If it takes an aggressive set up, then you will have to come back with a lighter polish or even D151.

I've seen Mike P. say this soooo many times but some want amazing results in the least amount of time and when it doesn't happen, they get upset.

Slow down and assess the situation. It may seem time consuming at first but then again, you won't have to sit here and wait for a response in your thread. That costs you more time than any!!!

[Dmitriy15]

Re: PC7424 + SONUS Pads + D151 = No Go

Right.... no one said I was in a rush or using short cuts.

Used what I had. Period. Thought that D151 could tackle swirls. Guess not. 105 it is.

[Justin Murphy]

Re: PC7424 + SONUS Pads + D151 = No Go

Right.... no one said I was in a rush or using short cuts.

Used what I had. Period. Thought that D151 could tackle swirls. Guess not. 105 it is.

There is a big difference between swirls (wash induced) and RIDS (deep scratches). There is also a big difference between paints and clearcoats.Big differences between machines too. A rotary may have taken out the deeper defects first and then you could have came back with the DA and cleaned up.

This is why I have 20 different polished at hand in sample bottles.

[Mike Phillips]

Re: PC7424 + SONUS Pads + D151 = No Go

There is a big difference between swirls (wash induced) and RIDS (deep scratches). There is also a big difference between paints and clearcoats.

Big differences between machines too. A rotary may have taken out the deeper defects first and then you could have came back with the DA and cleaned up.

This is why I have 20 different polished at hand in sample bottles.

Well said.

[miahjohn]

Re: PC7424 + SONUS Pads + D151 = No Go

I'm working with D151 on my moms Odyssey right now and pressure and speed is everything with this product in my opinion. My test spot was D151 on a W8006 with DA at Speed 4 and about 10lbs of pressure. Made the paint shiny and removed some swirls/haze on the paint but not some of the RIDS. Moved up to speed 5 and about 15lbs of pressure on a different spot and right away great results.

Also this product has a super long work time, so use that to your advantage. What I am doing now it starting at speed 5 and 15lbs for about a minute then moving down to speed 4 and 10lbs four another minute.

Ryan

super long work time is right! i just used some D151 today for the first time and this stuff works great. I used it with a rotary and had to use some good pressure. I used it on a black grand am that was nasty. paint came out shiny, clear and deep. and wow a small amount of D151 really goes a long way!