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Need advice on Pad/Product combination

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  • #1

    Need advice on Pad/Product combination

    Car: 1999 3 Series BMW

    Products Used: Makita rotary, Meguiar's 6.5 backing late and foam pads, M85, M3 and finishing off with M26 by hand

    First I did some wetsanding with a K1500 block and finished with 2000 paper.

    I then tried some M83 to test a sanded area. This combo didn't seem to make much headway, so I switched to my highest available abrasive the M85 and a W7006 pad.

    I got this car done but it seemed to take a lot of work and redoing the same areas more than once. About a third of the way through I turned the buffer up to about 2.5 (out of 5) which is a faster than I normally use. When I switched to the W8006 and the M3 I turned it up a little more.

    Does this Bimmer have an ultra hard "ceramic" clearcoat? The factory paint name is Fern Green.

    How would you have approached this job? After using nothing but 8" pads for decades, I just got the 6.5 pad kit and love it, but should I have used a wool pad? Higher RPM? M105?
    Tags: None
  • #2
    Re: Need advice on Pad/Product combination

    Give M105 a try if the product is available near you. Its a great compound and would hlp buffing off sanding marks quickly.

    Happy Testing

    Tim
    Learning new things everyday

    Comment

    • #3
      Re: Need advice on Pad/Product combination

      Yes A Wool Pad And Operator Skill Will Produce The Quickest Results With The Highest Risk ,film Build Should Be Checked 1st So You Know What Your Working With. I Like The Feel And Cushion Dbl Sided W5000.i Burnt My Share Of Paint The First Few Times Until I Developed The "feel" And Thats The Best Way I Can Describe Running The Wheel And When You Master It You Will Feel It And The Fear Will Be Gone.

      Bmw Does Have A Hard Finish But I Think A Ceramic Finish Is A Special Order. I Will Check With A Friend At Akzo Nobel ( They Are The Parent Co Of Sikkens And U-tech Paint Mfg) To See Which Mfg's Used Ceramic And When.

      Comment

      • #4
        Re: Need advice on Pad/Product combination

        Originally posted by SHYNEMAN123 View Post
        Yes A Wool Pad And Operator Skill Will Produce The Quickest Results With The Highest Risk ,film Build Should Be Checked 1st So You Know What Your Working With. I Like The Feel And Cushion Dbl Sided W5000.i Burnt My Share Of Paint The First Few Times Until I Developed The "feel" And Thats The Best Way I Can Describe Running The Wheel And When You Master It You Will Feel It And The Fear Will Be Gone.

        Bmw Does Have A Hard Finish But I Think A Ceramic Finish Is A Special Order. I Will Check With A Friend At Akzo Nobel ( They Are The Parent Co Of Sikkens And U-tech Paint Mfg) To See Which Mfg's Used Ceramic And When.
        I have no qualms or fear about using a wool pad and have plenty of experience with the 8" version, but I didn't have any wool 6.5's, only the three foams. I'm not sure M makes a 6.5 wool.

        I just reread the description of the W7006: "Removes moderate surface imperfections." Well, there's my problem. For the next hard clearcoat I guess I'll have to go with the WWHC7 and WWLC7 which probably will not work with the W64 plate.

        Comment

        • #5
          Re: Need advice on Pad/Product combination

          W-4006 Cut N Shine Is A Meguiars 6.5 But I Have Not Seen It In The Current Catalog. I Use 8 " On Large Areas For Speed And Switch Up For Tight Spots With 6.5 I Wish They Would Offer It In Dbl Sided. Which Do You Prefer ?

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          • #6
            Re: Need advice on Pad/Product combination

            Originally posted by SHYNEMAN123 View Post
            W-4006 Cut N Shine Is A Meguiars 6.5 But I Have Not Seen It In The Current Catalog. I Use 8 " On Large Areas For Speed And Switch Up For Tight Spots With 6.5 I Wish They Would Offer It In Dbl Sided. Which Do You Prefer ?
            I just got the 6.5 pads and plate and like the control for low abrasive work for small areas and obviously the foam 6.5 cutter didn't "cut" it on this last car. I have only used it on this 3 and a 5 Series, a bigger unit and I'd use the 8" at least for the sides. Never used a double sided.

            Comment

            • #7
              Re: Need advice on Pad/Product combination

              Originally posted by seth1066 View Post
              I'm not sure M makes a 6.5 wool.
              We used to have a 6" wool pad in our line but we discontinued it due to low sales volumes.

              If you're going to do some more wet-sanding work then you really want to get your hands on our new M105 Ultra Cut Compound and our W5000 double sided wool pad.

              This combination is designed to remove down to #1200 grit sanding marks of course the higher the grit you finish with the faster and easier it will be to remove the sanding marks.

              If you haven't tired this combination there's only one word that will describe their performance....

              Amazing


              M105 Ultra Cut Compound - New

              W5000 Double-Sided Wool Cutting Pad - New




              Mike Phillips
              760-515-0444
              showcargarage@gmail.com
              "Find something you like and use it often"

              Comment

              • #8
                Re: Need advice on Pad/Product combination

                Originally posted by Mike Phillips View Post
                We used to have a 6" wool pad in our line but we discontinued it due to low sales volumes.

                If you're going to do some more wet-sanding work then you really want to get your hands on our new M105 Ultra Cut Compound and our W5000 double sided wool pad.

                This combination is designed to remove down to #1200 grit sanding marks of course the higher the grit you finish with the faster and easier it will be to remove the sanding marks.

                If you haven't tired this combination there's only one word that will describe their performance....

                Amazing


                M105 Ultra Cut Compound - New

                W5000 Double-Sided Wool Cutting Pad - New



                Thanks Mike. I've had really great results with the Diamond Cut, but this 3 Series had a much harder finish. I have good assortment of 8" pads, but I'm really liking the control of the 6.5 pads. How about the 7" Solo wool pads with the M105? Also, would you guesstimate the max RPMs for this fairly hard clear coat with wool and the M105?

                Comment

                • #9
                  Re: Need advice on Pad/Product combination

                  First a quick note... M85 is not desired or recommended for use with foam pads but wool pads. You of course can use it how you like but I did want to point this out, it will tend to get gummy with foam.

                  Originally posted by seth1066 View Post
                  How about the 7" Solo wool pads with the M105? Also, would you guesstimate the max RPMs for this fairly hard clear coat with wool and the M105?
                  Sure, our Solo Pads would be another option you can try, as for maximum RPM's

                  Higher speeds don't always equate to more and better cutting, 1400 rpms to 1500 rpms should be sufficient for removing #2000 grit sanding marks.

                  Good technique is the most important factor after pad and product selection.


                  Mike Phillips
                  760-515-0444
                  showcargarage@gmail.com
                  "Find something you like and use it often"

                  Comment

                  • #10
                    Re: Need advice on Pad/Product combination

                    Originally posted by Mike Phillips View Post
                    First a quick note... M85 is not desired or recommended for use with foam pads but wool pads. You of course can use it how you like but I did want to point this out, it will tend to get gummy with foam.

                    Sure, our Solo Pads would be another option you can try, as for maximum RPM's

                    Higher speeds don't always equate to more and better cutting, 1400 rpms to 1500 rpms should be sufficient for removing #2000 grit sanding marks.

                    Good technique is the most important factor after pad and product selection.
                    Ran into that exact problem with the foam pad and M85 and had to rinse it out about half way through the job. I think I'll try the Solo backing and wools supplemented by a set of the new 7" washables. Thanks again.

                    Comment

                    • #11
                      Re: Need advice on Pad/Product combination

                      Here's an update on the BMW; the problem was the M85 and a foam pad, as Mike pointed out, it's not recommended and doesn't come close to working as well as when used with wool. So it wasn't a paint hardness issue.

                      My work didn't look as well as I first thought. I redid the previously wet sanded areas with the Makita rotary and M85/wool. Now, here's the interesting part, I just bought a G110 and did M83/W7006, followed by M03/W8006 and then M26/9006.

                      The G110 produced outstanding results and having been a rotary only guy since 1976, it was a real blast using it for the first time. I was surprised the power this buffer has as well as the fact that it was so much less tiring to handle. I'm totally sold on this machine and think that the rotary/G110 combination is unbeatable.

                      Thanks to Mike Phillips for solving my M85 problem and special thanks to Rod Kraft who helped me with some information I needed to purchase the G110. I bought it from Total Auto Parts in Herndon, VA; they carry a good deal of the Meguiar's product line if you're in the area. Also thanks to Lucy at Meguire's who got me in touch with Rod; this was excellent customer service.

                      Comment

                      • #12
                        Re: Need advice on Pad/Product combination

                        I just read through a few of Mike Phillips excellent posts on the use of DA machines and found that a foam cutting pad like the W7006 with a product like M83 can cause some hazing. I finished the top surfaces tonight and our shop is not as well lit as it should be, so I hope I'm not in for a surprise tomorrow morning. I did check closely with an incandescent work light, so maybe I saved myself with the application of the M03/W8006 after the M83/W7006, but the Sun will tell the story tomorrow.

                        With the addition of the new machine, I have to re-ask the question this way, what's the best course for the G110 for this car after using the rotary/M85/wool?

                        I have on hand:

                        Pads: W7006, W8006, W9006

                        Products:

                        M85
                        Solo Cream w/o pad system
                        M83
                        M66
                        M09
                        M03
                        M26

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