not happy with new paint

[Full-Force]

My friend just painted my car for me and I am not 100% happy with it. The paint looked awesome right out of the gun. It had less texture than a factory paint job. It really layed flat. If not for a couple of runs and some trash in the paint I would have been happy with no buffing.

Ok, after he buffed it I am now not happy with it. My car is black and now the car doesnt look as black anymore. It looks faded and washed out. There also swirl mars all in it. After I washed it for the first time it looked like a 10 year old paint job. What happened is the polish was washed off and the cloudy look Im seeing is the scratches left from the cutting and buffing.

Now everytime I was the car I have to repolish it or it looks faded and the swirl mars still are there. Basicly I think the paint job was awesome, and I think the cutting process was done right but the buffing process I think was not done right.

It lost all of the depth of the black after buffing.

I need to know step by step process to get this fixed to where all the depth is back and it doesnt look faded evertime I wash it. Sorry so long.

[Derrick]

Re: not happy with new paint

Can you post up some pics? Is the fading due to just all the buffer swirls or is there also something else making it look faded?
Most likely with out seeing it i would say it is the buffer swirls making it look faded and old. If there are alot of swirls on the vehicle then they do tend to look real faded from a distance. Also what will you be working with to remove the swirls. Do you own a DA or Rotary? A list of what you have to work with will help in a write up of a step by step process or do you just want to know what to buy as well?

[Nappers]

Re: not happy with new paint

How new is the paint?

The Solo line is for new paint and should be able to bring it back.

Some pictures should help with the pro's here helping out .

Aaron

[Mike Phillips]

Re: not happy with new paint

Basically I think the paint job was awesome, and I think the cutting process was done right but the buffing process I think was not done right.

It lost all of the depth of the black after buffing.

I need to know step by step process to get this fixed to where all the depth is back and it doesn't look faded every time I wash it. Sorry so long.

Sad to say this is the norm for bodyshops...

It doesn't matter how good the paint job is, it's the process used to cut and polish the paint as well as the skills and professionalism of the person doing the work that will determine the end-results.

Truth is most body shops have great painters, but often times after the paint has set up for a day or two, it's the "Painter's Helper", or the shop detailer that does the dirty work, or in other words the wet-sanding, cutting and polishing work and this guy is often not given very good tools or training or time to do the job the right way.

Regardless if in you case it was the actual painter that did the polishing work or someone else, at this point the best way to fix this problem is you're going to have to learn how to use a machine to undo the damage.

If you're lucky, the swirls are not too deep and you can remove them using a tool like our G110 with one of our cleaner/polishes to remove some paint off the surface in an effort to level the surface and thus remove the swirls and haze.

Just a reality check, you do understand that removing swirls mean removing paint?

If this sounds like an option you are willing to undertake let us know and we'll guide you through the process; basically you're going to want to get the below and then dive in and learn how to do it.

• $149.99 - G110 DA Polisher
  
• $80.00 - This would be for 6 W-8006 Polishing Pads, you can probably do the job with less but when it comes to buffing out entire cars then usually more pads is better.
  
• $16.20 - A quart of M80 Speed Glaze - Hopefully this will be aggressive enough to remove enough paint to remove the swirls

Of course you'll need other things like some Blue Painter's Tape to tape off anything you don't want to get polish or wax on, you'll need plenty of quality microfiber polishing cloths, a quality wax etc.




3-6

[Full-Force]

Re: not happy with new paint

Let me see if I can add a lil more info.

Car has 3 coats of clear.

The guy that cut and buffed it started with 1000, then 1500, then a d/a sander with a 3000 pad on it.

Now here is where I think process went wrong. The buffing process started with some kind of 3M liquid compound(not sure how aggressive), and then changed pads and went to scratch x. Thats it. Compound and a yellow foam pad, the sctach x and a black pad.

When I wash the car the paint looks faded and washed out. Its cloudy and has a ton of swirl marks. I then apply scratch x by hand with microfibers and the black will come back mostly but the swirl marks wont go away and it seems to add just as many swirl marks as it takes away.

Painter is trying to tell me that eventually I wont have to polish the car every time I wash it.

I will try to get pics when I was it again.

Help.

[Mike Phillips]

Re: not happy with new paint

Let me see if I can add a lil more info.

Car has 3 coats of clear.

The guy that cut and buffed it started with 1000, then 1500, then a d/a sander with a 3000 pad on it.

Now here is where I think process went wrong. The buffing process started with some kind of 3M liquid compound(not sure how aggressive), and then changed pads and went to scratch x. Thats it. Compound and a yellow foam pad, the scratch x and a black pad.

The above is not really a system...

This paint job really needs to be re-buffed by someone that knows what they're doing. First, you make sure there are no pigtails, these are little squiggly circle scratches where an abrasive particle has left a deeper scratch. The goal of the guy doing the buffing would have been to remove all the sanding marks, what you're doing is inspect to see if they have indeed been removed during his compounding step, that's likely the 3M product you saw.

His second-step polishing process is with a very light swirl and scratch remover by hand or DA Polisher, it's about as aggressive as either our M82 or M09, that is to say it is a light cleaner. It's not intended to be applied using a rotary buffer, so his use is mis-use. He's trying to remove or reduce the swirls left by his first-step process, this is his swirl removal finishing step.

Note: If the ScratchX was truly the last product to touch the paint after which he gave you back your car, then ScratchX was his LSP which is also the wrong use of a product.

Probably the best option would depend upon how important this paint job is to you?

Do you want it clear and swirl free? Then maybe you should consider locating a qualified Professional and hiring them to re-do the buff-out. Then after they restore the finish all you have to do is maintain it, much easier.

That said if you want to try to fix it yourself the most effective way is going to be starting with a rotary buffer and then finishing with a DA Polisher. Besides the machines you 'll need some different types of pads, wool and foam, then a compound, then a cleaner/polish and then a wax once its 30 days old or whatever your painter told you.

Just let us know what direction you want to go.

[Mike Phillips]

Re: not happy with new paint

Here's some threads to check out...

How to tape-off a car

Can a Rotary Buffer like a Makita or DeWalt be as Idiot-proof as a PC?

Learning to use the Rotary Buffer


It's possible that if the scratches are all removed to your satisfaction so all you need to do is remove the swirls which is what makes the paint look hazy instead of clear, then you might be able do just use a DA Polisher like our G110

It will still be a lot of work and take a number of hours to go all the way around the car.


What kind of car are you working on?

[Derrick]

Re: not happy with new paint

Here's some threads to check out...

How to tape-off a car

Can a Rotary Buffer like a Makita or DeWalt be as Idiot-proof as a PC?

Learning to use the Rotary Buffer


It's possible that if the scratches are all removed to your satisfaction so all you need to do is remove the swirls which is what makes the paint look hazy instead of clear, then you might be able do just use a DA Polisher like our G110

It will still be a lot of work and take a number of hours to go all the way around the car.


What kind of car are you working on?

I agree, as long as he removed all the sanding marks with the compound process you should be able to get it back with something like the G110 with some W8006 and W9006 pads along with some #80 and maybe even #83 but that will be determined by how hard the paint is and how bad the swirls are. Every once in a while you will run into paint that is to hard and the DA just doesnt have the power to cut through it so a rotary is required but hopefully that is not the case here.

[pOrk]

Re: not happy with new paint

3000 isn't going to take out 1500 scratches, just bury them.

If this was my project, I would start the process over again and make sure I do it right. The first step would be wet sanding BY HAND with 1000, then 1500, then 2000, then 2500. If you have access to a finishing DA, throw a 3000 pad on it and lightly go over it. If not, no big deal I rarely use mine. Finishing with 2500 will do, as its usually one step further then most body shops go.

Once that is done, pull out the buffer and use a light cutting compound and then a polish compound. I usually use 3M products for this process, they are easily had here at my local paint depot. Once this is done, you should have the gloss depth and shine as a new paint job should have. If its been more then 30 days, throw a coat of NXT 2.0 on it and you should be ready to rock.

[Mike Phillips]

Re: not happy with new paint

3000 isn't going to take out 1500 scratches, just bury them.

If this was my project, I would start the process over again and make sure I do it right.

That's kind of what we wrote.

That said, from the available information we have in this post about the OP's skills, abilities and experience with advanced paint correction procedures, i.e. wet-sanding, cutting and polishing with a rotary buffer, we have to provide answers and solutions that match their ability to use the recommendations.

Hopefully Full Force will update us as to the direction they want to go with this project.

[Full-Force]

Re: not happy with new paint

Car is a 99 Z28 Camaro.

He used a paint paddle or stirrer with the sandpaper wrapped around it when he wet sanded it.

The car looks to good to not go the distance to make it what I want. The paint is really slick and looks like a piece of glass, just with swirls and washed out looking if that makes sense.

[Ryan L.]

Re: not happy with new paint

Sorry to hear about your problematic new paint. We recently had to have the back passenger section of the car repainted after some damage and when we picked it up I brought three different types of lighting and took about 20 minutes to go over the paint and make sure everything was fine. Looked great then but now its got little tiny scratches all over it like it hasn't cured yet. They told me to only wash it for 60 days and it was 45 days before I even washed it for the first time so I know it was cured well beyond the time. Since it was insurance work I am going to take it back and see if they'll respray it but thats almost as likely as world peace.

Hopefully you can get your problem figured out.

Ryan

[Mike Phillips]

Re: not happy with new paint

Full Force: Any updates?

This paint job really needs to be re-buffed by someone that knows what they're doing.

Think the above is still the direction you need to go.