Help please

[Lydia]

Hey y'all,
I was going to attempt to buff out my Dad's car today. I got it washed, but now I'm not sure what to do. After scrubbing it very well with a wash brush (not Meg's brand because I can't find anywhere that carries them around here and I needed it today) and rinsing it off, it still looked dirty. To see if it was still dirty, I rubbed my finger back and forth on it and sure enough, dirty water was coming off (the car was soaking wet) and it looked cleaner where I'd rubbed my finger. Let me tell y'all a little about this car so you have a better idea what I'm working with and why that's happening. It is a 1989 Oldsmobile 88, grey single stage. Maybe it was silver at first, but this car is very very badly oxidized. I can not see a reflection AT ALL in the hood, roof, and trunk lid. The sides are in better condition, and I can see a little bit of reflection in them. The sides came clean when I washed it. The hood, trunk, and roof are so badly oxidized the dirt has worked it's way into all the tiny crevices in the paint. The paint is rough. Now I don't expect this car to buff out to looking like new, in fact I know it won't. But do y'all have any advice as to how to get the dirt out of the paint? My Dad is gone for the weekend and I want to have this finished by the time he gets back. Thanks so much in advance for any advice!

On a side note, while I'm waiting for replies (and also while I was waiting for the car to dry) I washed and started buffing my truck. The bad scratches on the side that have been bothering me for a while are WAY less noticeable after two passes with #83 and two passes with #80. The worst ones are still there because they are through to the primer, but all of them are much less noticeable. Whoo-hoo!! Thanks Meguiar's!!

[Murr1525]

Re: Help please

Well, you can always wash a second time, but if it wont get the dirt, then it probably wont.

Just go on to claying, and see what happens....

[mnaines]

Re: Help please

After washing the truck and letting it dry, clay it first, then add ColorX, then Deep Crystal Paint Cleaner and work each one in real good to clear up the oxidation. After that's done, add Deep Crystal Polish and work that in real good, then add a coating of Meguiar's NXT Generation Tech Wax.

Also, it would help if we had pictures.

[Lydia]

Re: Help please

Thank y'all for the help.

Mnaines, I plan to use the G100 and #83 to remove the oxidation. It's way too oxidized to take care of by hand. I do appreciate the advice though!

I tried claying and it seemed to help some. It ruined the clay very quickly too (although I probably would have used it longer except I dropped it in the sand ). It was getting dark, though, so I guess I'll have to finish it tomorrow.

[mnaines]

Re: Help please

I would do it by hand first to remove most of the embedded dirt, otherwise you'll end up replacing the pad more often than you should. Also, if you're going to do it by machine, I'd use M80 Speed Glaze on the PC/G100 with a foam polishing pad.

[Lydia]

Re: Help please

I do appreciate the help, but if you saw the condition this car is in, you would probably agree it needs #83. #80 would probably work on the sides, but on the roof, hood, and trunk lid, #83 is needed. I'm not even sure if I will be able to remove the oxidation with #83 but it is worth a try. The oxidation is almost as bad as this car: http://meguiarsonline.com/forums/sho...hlight=old+dog

Do you think doing it by hand would help remove the embedded dirt? I was hoping I could remove it by claying/scrubbing, but if you think ColorX or DC#1 would remove the embedded dirt, I might try that.

[the other pc]

Re: Help please

On a car in that condition I’d be prepared to use up a clay bar.

I suppose you could do a test spot with the #80 but it sounds like you’re probably right that #83 will be the ticket. Keep a towel and brush handy and clean your pad often.

And have a Happy Thanksgiving!


PC.

[mnaines]

Re: Help please

I would definitely use the clay bar first and lubricate it with the NXT Generation Speed Detailer, followed by a treatment of ScratchX or ColorX to get the stuff on top of the paint off, then DC#1 to get all the oxidation and embedded dirt off, just make sure you have a LOT of microfiber towels handy. Once all the dirt and oxidation is off (or at least most of it), go over it once with the machine polisher and a medium-power cleaner/polish to get off the more stubborn stuff, then finish with DC#2 and NXT Generation Tech Wax.

[Jeepster04]

Re: Help please

I would definitely use the clay bar first and lubricate it with the NXT Generation Speed Detailer, followed by a treatment of ScratchX or ColorX to get the stuff on top of the paint off, then DC#1 to get all the oxidation and embedded dirt off, just make sure you have a LOT of microfiber towels handy. Once all the dirt and oxidation is off (or at least most of it), go over it once with the machine polisher and a medium-power cleaner/polish to get off the more stubborn stuff, then finish with DC#2 and NXT Generation Tech Wax.

Just a quik question.. Why do you not want her to use #80 or #83? And why do you want her to do it by hand? Wouldnt it take ALOT less time to do it with the PC? even if she does need to change the pad often?

I do not mean to say your wrong or anything.. Just wondering what your reason is..

Hmmm. Thanksgiving is almost over.. :-(

[Jeff Smith]

Re: Help please

On a car that looks like the "Old Dog" in Superior Shines thread, I suspect that it might not necessarily be dirt on the finish that you are still rubbing off but likely old dead paint.

I am assuming that you don't have a few extra pads around. Correct me if I am wrong.

If the most aggressive product I had on hand was #83, and I only one pad for it. Keeping in mind you wish to get this done fast. I would likely consider hitting, at least the horizontals surfaces with ScratchX. The reason I say this is that you are likely going to hose up a pad or maybe even 2-3 on paint that bad. If the pads are an issue, Try ScratchX with a terry towel on the horizontals to get some of the crud off. After using the ScratchX then Clay. Then go with the #83 and a 8006 pad.

Somewhere in here is a thread that lays out an approach where the first step is ScratchX then claying then cleaning. I'll poke around and see if I can find it.

Editing here. I found the link. http://www.meguiarsonline.com/forums...+Oxidized+Clay

[the other pc]

Re: Help please

I see the reasoning behind doing some hand work first but I don’t agree it’s necessarily needed just because the finish is heavily oxidized. Maybe it’s just my own lack of experience (and if I do more I might change my mind).

As far as I’m concerned clay and pads are tools to and end. If they’re consumed attaining that end so be it. I don’t care if I trash a little clay as long as it does its job. I’m more interested in working efficiently, achieving the maximum results for the work I put in.

The most deteriorated finish I’ve worked on lately was an oxidized single stage red on a car that belongs to a friend of mine. The horizontal surfaces had lost practically all gloss. They felt and looked like chalk. We washed and clayed as always. Yes, the clay loaded up pretty badly but I didn’t care. The point was to remove above surface contaminants that would interfere with buffing. The clay started white and turned pink. It couldn’t make the finish as smooth as glass but it was satin smooth and easy to buff.

The pad loaded up while buffing but certainly wasn’t damaged in any way. I just cleaned it often and kept plugging away.

Here’s the initial test spot. It was done with the G100 and #80. The color was coming back but the gloss was low and there were lots of cobweb scratches.


That was going too slow, as was #83 with the G100 so I switched to the rotary with #1 Medium Cut Cleaner. Here, the trunk lid was mostly done and you can see the difference between the lid and the untouched portions of the adjacent panel.


Here’s the lid with the oxidation removed. The gloss was pretty good at this point but we were still working on 25 years worth of random scratches.



PC.


.

[Lydia]

Re: Help please

Thanks for all the suggestions, y'all.

Nice job on that car, PC.

Well, I started on the car this AM by claying two test spots. One spot on the side, and one on the roof. I clayed the spot on the roof many many times and it was still making the clay grey. But I'm not sure if that matters, because once I started buffing it out, I realized I wasn't working with a single stage paint. When I was buffing the hood a while back (I did a test spot a few weeks ago), because of the black stuff (I guess it was dirt and dead paint) transferring onto the pad, I assumed it was single stage. Well, I don't know why I didn't notice the point where the clear coat started again. So, what I have to work on is a BC/CC car with no clear coat at all on the roof, hood, and trunk lid.

FWIW, the paint on the sides is in pretty good condition and with just one pass of #83 it was looking pretty good. I think on the sides I can probably do 2 passes of #80, then wax and it will look fine. As for the horizontal surfaces, . I'm not sure if its even worth doing anything to them. After three passes with #83, there was some improvement showing, but I don't think it will be worth the products to buff it out. After all, it is a pretty old car and just used on Sundays and when the weather is to bad for my Dad to ride his motorcycle.

My Dad would like me to put a coat of wax on in but I'm not sure if it will worth it even (at least on the horizontal surfaces...the vertical surfaces I will probably buff with #80 or #83 and put a coat of wax on). The paint is so rough that I don't think I will be able to rub any wax off; it will probably just all collect in the crevices. Maybe instead of spending time on the horizontal surfaces, I'll clean out his garage...I bet that'd make him happy. Lol.

I have another question. My sisters cars are also at my house over the weekend. I would like to buff and wax them some but they have their problems too. One is a grey '93 Honda Accord, and the other is a maroon '97 Mazda 626.

The Accord's only problem is my sister had lost control on a wet road and spun around and hit a mailbox with the side of her car (fortunately not anyone was hurt!). My Dad took the side off and banged it out even, but it's still really rough and rusted some. The 626 has a similar problem.

If I do buff their cars, what should I do where they got messed up? Just mask it off and not do anything at all to that part? Or should I try to gently put a coat of wax on? On the 626, the paint isn't broken much at all, but there is white paint transfer. Could I buff over the rough spots where the metal is crinkled but the paint isn't broken? Or should I just do that by hand with ScratchX?

Sorry for the really long post, and thanks for all the help!

[Jeff Smith]

Re: Help please

I see the reasoning behind doing some hand work first but I don’t agree it’s necessarily needed just because the finish is heavily oxidized. Maybe it’s just my own lack of experience (and if I do more I might change my mind).

As far as I’m concerned clay and pads are tools to and end. If they’re consumed attaining that end so be it. I don’t care if I trash a little clay as long as it does its job. I’m more interested in working efficiently, achieving the maximum results for the work I put in.

I agree with you PC. I guess I kind of read into thing a little and made the assumption that Lydia may not have any spare Clay or Pads handy and I felt since there was a time crunch involved it might be a good idea to knock some of the junk off with ScratchX before claying and cleaning so as to increase the likelyhood of not needing any more clay or pads.

I personnaly would not have gone this route as I tend to keep ridiculous numbers of pads and clay around considering I am not in the business.

[the other pc]

Re: Help please

...If I do buff their cars, what should I do where they got messed up? ...

There’s not much point to polishing those areas since they’re trashed. At most I’d use a little cleaner/wax by hand, just to keep them from deteriorating faster than the surrounding panels.


PC.