#84 and #85? big difference?

[Weekend Detailer]

I'm looking to purchase a more aggressive cleaner/compound to help remove swirls in a shorter amount of time. My friend and I have been using #83 on a Light Cutting Pad on the PC and it has helped us remove the worst of swirls, but since the PC needs a slow motion and several passes to diminish the product, the process still takes a long time.

So, I recently purchased a Makita Rotary and have been practicing with it for some time. My latest question is to know more about the differences between #84 and #85 other than the different cutting levels (9 and 10 respectively). Are there noticeable differences between the two? If I use #85, do I still need to use #84? How does the surface look after the two products? I still must use #83 afterwards, correct? I could use any and all help provided.

Additionally, I am repainted my bumper do to damage from the hurricane. Will it be okay to use a pure wax or NXT/#21 shorty after the paint, or do I need to let the paint cure?

[Pete-FWA]

Though the cutting level is only one number different in the scale, the products show discernable differences. Recommended application method is different as well. Also, I find M84 to stay wetter longer, so it lends itself to use with foam pads more than M85.

M84 Compound Power Cleaner, is best with the W7000/7006 foam pad. M85 Diamond Cut is best with W4000 wool pad. Neither of these scours or leaves bad marks in a solid finish. They are strong, aggressive cleaners, but nothing too harsh.

When I use either of them, I follow with 83 to remove marks in virtually all cases. I go from 85 to 83 with no problems, so you wouldn't have to use 84 between them.

Have you tried 83 with the W7000 foam? In some cases, that steps you up enough to remove defects without having to use one of the stronger products. This will leave polisher marks, but it's a less aggressive step than M85 or M84. Follow with another application of 83 with a W8000/8006 or even M80 with W8000/8006.

As for the new paint, most body shops will tell you to let fresh paint cure/outgas for 45-60 days. I can't recall anyone saying less than 30 is safe.

[Mike Phillips]

M85 is formulated for use with a wool pad while M84 is formulated for use with a foam pad. With a foam pad you need more lubrication.

[Mike Phillips]

Re: #84 and #85? big difference?

Originally posted by Weekend Detailer
If I use #85, do I still need to use #84? How does the surface look after the two products? I still must use #83 afterwards, correct? I could use any and all help provided.

Typically you would use one compound/pad combination or the other but not both.

After making your heavy cut to remove defects, then you would re-polish each panel to remove any heavy swirls using a less aggressive product and pad.

Then to insure a swirl free finish you would re-polish each panel again using a dual action polisher as you need to get away from the rotating action of a pad on the paint to get away from the holograms or swirls.

If you haven't watched this, give it a go...

To Purchase the PES101V, click the below link,

"How to remove paint defects"

To watch the video for free at BetterCarCare.com, click the below link,

How To Remove Paint Defects

Note: To watch this video online you will need,

RealPlayer for Window’s systems. For all other operation systems, visit Real.com This presentation will not play without the RealPlayer browser plug in or a DSL/cable broadband Internet connection.

[Mosca]

Mike,

The last couple times Rod came up and showed us stuff, he did something that I think is worth remarking on.

He was using a wool cutting pad and #85; but what he was doing was taking the surface down to almost perfect clarity using ONLY the wool pad and #85. Then when Jamie Schuehoff (the local distributor) came over to help us last month, he did the same thing. Both were using slow speed, around 1000 rpm, keeping the tool moving and working a small area (about 2ft square, maximum).

The implication is that when properly applied, the diminishing abrasives will get very fine and truly "polish out".

I understand that they are both professionals with many years of experience. But they still did a heck of a nice job!

Although I don't remember his exact words, Rod indicated to me that the "9" and "10" are relative to the other Meguiar's products. It's not like "10" is just short of coarse grit sandpaper. It will definitely cut, but it's not like rubbing it between your fingers will make them bleed. The general advice for proper use was, "Use your head, don't press on the tool, let the product and the pad and the tool do the work." (Along with working a small area at around 1000 rpm and keeping the tool moving.) Using that instruction, I've been getting more satisfactory results using #84 with the rotary than I have been getting from #83. I've been using it with the 7006 or 7000 pad. I've been finishing with #82 the PC and a polishing pad (I'm not Rod nor Jamie).

I'll be helping a friend do his newly acquired '88 Saab 900 on Sunday, I'll bring a camera and document it and maybe get some feedback.


Tom