color sanding and all that good stuff by hand

[tomsteve]

my son is gonna be pretty happy when he gets outta "the sandbox" in feb. the new paint came out very good fro beint the first car i have ever prepped and put back together!!! the painter did a great job and gave me good advise all the way thru preppin it. so now i have to get her" raquel"...thats the name i gave her until my son gets home) wet sanded. i want to do the work myself, but since i havent done it b4, want to get all the info i can. i dont own a rotary buffer and really dont wanna learn on his car and would like to do the work myself. so can ya'll point me to some good threads on the process of color canding and pointers and all that good stuff? if necessary, i will take it in and have it buffed up, but would still rather do it myself. thanks in advance.

[Mike Phillips]

Re: color sanding and all that good stuff by hand

You have three options, none of them are perfect... that's because wet-sanding a complete car down and then removing the sanding marks is hard work no matter how you do it and no matter how good or even great you are at it. It's not fast, it's not clean, it's not easy.

How's that for an intro?

Here's your options,

• [1] Take it to someone else that knows what they're doing and pay them to sand and buff the paint.

• [2] Purchase a rotary buffer and learn to do it yourself. You can spread the work out and only do a panel a day, this will still be a lot of work and the longer you take then chances are the more difficult it will be to remove the sanding marks.

• [3] Invest a lot of time in the sanding process by finishing with a very high grit paper and then remove the sanding marks by hand and become the personification of "Put some passion behind the pad"

Before I type up a book on each one of these three options, tell me which one interests you the most and let's just focus on the products and procedures for that step...

[Mike Phillips]

Re: color sanding and all that good stuff by hand

Remind us...

What are you working on?

Do you know how many coats of clear your painter sprayed and can you ask him if they were heavy coats or light coats or anything that would give us an indication of how thick the clear layer is.

When it comes to sanding and buffing a paint job you need to keep in mind that sanding removes some paint and buffing removes some paint, so we need to know we have enough paint or film-build to work with as we don't want to make a mistake.

You also want to get right on this project because the more days that go by the harder the paint will become, you really only have a few days if that here the sanding marks are easily removed no matter who does the work and no matter how the marks are removed.

[tomsteve]

Re: color sanding and all that good stuff by hand

You have three options, none of them are perfect... that's because wet-sanding a complete car down and then removing the sanding marks is hard work no matter how you do it and no matter how good or even great you are at it. It's not fast, it's not clean, it's not easy.

How's that for an intro?

Here's your options,

• [1] Take it to someone else that knows what they're doing and pay them to sand and buff the paint.

• [2] Purchase a rotary buffer and learn to do it yourself. You can spread the work out and only do a panel a day, this will still be a lot of work and the longer you take then chances are the more difficult it will be to remove the sanding marks.

• [3] Invest a lot of time in the sanding process by finishing with a very high grit paper and then remove the sanding marks by hand and become the personification of "Put some passion behind the pad"

Before I type up a book on each one of these three options, tell me which one interests you the most and let's just focus on the products and procedures for that step...

2 is intimidating as i dont wanna screw up the paint, but i do have some donor panels to practice on,3 sounds possible as i have intil the end of feb. that is when his tour is up. i , or the painter, used sherwin williams dimensions basecoat ( 3 coats as the paint is rather transluscent) and 3 heavy clearcoats. the paint was sprayed in a shop dedicated to auto painting, but the paint wasnt baked on. it has been 11 days since painting. i personally dont have a problem with spending time doin all the work by hand and since i am on disability due to some surgeries to carve out cancer, am limited on the income. that is one reason i want to do it all myself. plus personal gratification. i am gonna get some pics posted here today hopefully of what i got goin on.

[Mike Phillips]

Re: color sanding and all that good stuff by hand

it has been 11 days since painting.

i personally don't have a problem with spending time doing all the work by hand and since i am on disability due to some surgeries to carve out cancer, am limited on the income. that is one reason i want to do it all myself. plus personal gratification.

i am gonna get some pics posted here today hopefully of what i got going on.

Okay here's what you're going to need,

#1500 grit sanding paper
#2000 grit sanding paper
#2500 grit sanding paper
M105 Ultra Cut Compound
Terry Cloth Towel - High quality terry cloth, like a Cannon or Fieldcrest
Spray Bottle for a water and soap solution
Bucket for your sanding papers
Elbow Grease



Instead of loading up on a ton of supplies, first see if this is doable at all for you by going to your local PBE store and most of the time you can purchase individual half-sheets of wet/dry sanding paper.

So first you need to locate a PBE store and become friends with the counter people as they can help you to get the products you'll need for this project.

How to locate Meguiar's Professional and Detailer products in your hometown


If you're really going to tackle this project then you're going to have to get at least start with getting a quart of M105 Ultra Cut Compound and then pick up a few sheets of #2000 grit paper and a sanding backing pad to wrap the paper around. You want a medium density rubber backing pad not a soft gushy one as the stiffer, flat face of the pad behind the sandpaper is going to help you to remove the orange peel by removing the high points and getting the surface flat.

Meguiar's offers this one, 5 1/2" Sanding Backing Pad but you can find a variety of these at your PBE store, you want one that fits a half-sheet of sanding paper when you fold the paper around it.



You'll also want to get a spray bottle for to use for a clean source of water and put a few drops of car wash soap in with the water to help lubricate the sanding process.

Mirror Glaze Spray Bottle With Sprayer


You can find something similar by Rubbermaid at any Target Store.

Just a note on getting products, when you locate your local PBE store, if they don't have the M105 in stock they can order it for you, you may even have to print out this page and show them in-case they're not up to speed with new products in their industry.

You're also going to want to get some higher grit finishing papers like our Nikken #2500 grit because if you are able to do the below test spot successfully and decide to really tackle the entire car, then it's going to be faster to invest more time sanding and finishing with a higher grit after initially cutting the paint with a lower grit than it will be to finish with a lower grit and then struggle to remove these deeper sanding marks by hand.

Lets do a test with what the PBE store already has in stock and make sure you feel confident tackling this project before you start spending money ordering in products.

So get the M105 and at least a few sheets of #2000 grit wet/dry papers, most PBE stores will carry 3M brand and sell individual sheets, if not then you may have to buy what's called a sleeve of half-sheets.

Mix your water and a few drops of soap into your spray bottle, place a few sheets of your sanding paper into a bucket of water to let them soak a few minutes before starting and then when you're ready, sand a section about 8" square on an easy to work on panel like the hood or the trunk lid.

Sand in a straight line but hold your sanding paper wrapped around a backing pad at about 45 degrees angle. Here's an article with some of the basics for hand sanding...

Hand Sanding Techniques

This is correct, hold the backing pad at about a 45% degree angle in
relationship to the direction you're moving your hand.



Sand for 8-12 strokes to this small area with medium pressure to start with and then lighten up a little for your last strokes and then wipe the area dry and inspect the flatness of the area as compared to the surrounding orange peel.

This area should be flat, if not then sand a few more strokes. You want to discover how much you need to sand to remove the orange peel and get the surface flat and then stop. The goal is a flat finish but stopping as soon as you can as you only want to remove enough paint to get flat, no more as this is your precious film-build for the service life of the car.

After you get this one area flat, by the way might want to time yourself and see how long it takes to sand a small area flat. Next take and cut up a clean, plush soft terry cloth towel so you have a piece of cloth about 5" square or so, you're going to fold this piece in half and then use this folded piece of cloth to work the M105 over the paint, so you don't want it too big and you don't want ti too small. You do want to use a folded piece of cloth and not a flat piece, the folded piece will give you two layers of terry cloth which gives you a little substance to spread out the pressure of your fingers.

Take this cloth and some M105, about a tablespoon to start with as a dry piece of cloth will absorb some of the M105. Now spread this product out over the area you sanded and after you spread it out start working it over the sanding marks in a back and forth direction overlapping your passes.

You're going to have to apply some pressure or put some passion behind your pad and really work this product, it's not a slow hand movement process it's a get busy with it processes.

Work the M105 over this area for about a minute and then inspect your results. You should see some or most of the sanding marks removed where you rubbed and a shiny, more clear finish but you'll likely still see saning marks and Tracers left behind.

This just means more rubbing with M105

Finishing with a higher grit paper will make removing sanding marks easier and more complete because the sanding marks or scratches won't be as deep.

Just make sure you can do this process with a few sheets of whatever paper you can find at your local PBE store and when you make the decision that you're going to do the entire car then spend a little money and order in some of our Nikken #2500 for your finishing paper.

Anyway, that's the process you're going to want to do to each entire panel and then once you finish one panel move on to the next panel.

[Mike Phillips]

Re: color sanding and all that good stuff by hand

Click the link below to go to a page on M105 that you can print out to take with you to the PBE store.

If you print this page out you're going to print out the entire first page of this thread and you don't need all this information. Click the link below and jut print out one or two pages and print in "Landscape" mode as the forum prints out very wide.

M105 Ultra Cut Compound - New





M105 Ultra-Cut Compound
Exclusive, super-micro abrasive technology
FEATURES:
• Ultra-fast cutting removes 1200 grit or finer sanding marks
• Super-micro abrasives leave best in class finish
• Also great for removing scratches, defects, acid rain and severe swirls/holograms
• For use with a rotary buffer or by hand
• Not intended to be used with a dual action polisher

M10532 MSRP $30.00
M10501 MSRP $90.00

[Jimmy Buffit]

Re: color sanding and all that good stuff by hand

Wow, this sounds like a very looong task! I cannot imagine doing the entire car by hand!

Having said that, it is exactly the process that we use in the shop for deep scratch repair.

Excellent writeup, Mike.

Jim

[Mike Phillips]

Re: color sanding and all that good stuff by hand

Wow, this sounds like a very looong task! I cannot imagine doing the entire car by hand!

It's a huge undertaking but if he's got enough passion it can be done. We want to have him take baby steps first and keep his investment low until he feels comfortable with tackling the entire car.

Also thought about trying to find a few forum members near West Branch, Michigan who might want to make it a project to give him a hand, (no pun intended)

[tomsteve]

Re: color sanding and all that good stuff by hand

i also get into scroolsaw work. i have a clock that has approx. 70 hrs. into it. another one i am building has about 60 hrs into it already, and theres about another 100 hrs. of work to go. i think i might know a bit about patience as i am a bit of a perfectionist. awesome info and we have a PBE here in west branch.they carry meguiars and are a very good body shop supply store. thanls for the write up and i will see iffen i can figger out my honey's digital camera to get pics up somewhere on the site. see ya in a few weeks!!!LOL!!!!

[J. A. Michaels]

Re: color sanding and all that good stuff by hand

Best of luck to you. I have a good feeling your son is going to be shocked when he comes home from the sandbox.

[tomsteve]

Re: color sanding and all that good stuff by hand

well, he hasnt even seen the car yet. he put me in charge of findin a car for him in july. he wanted a mustang and this is what he got. so, yes he will be shocked. pretty clean car, just that the clearcoat was failing and decided it should have fresh paint. but like i said, i'm a bit of a perfectionist. she is pretty darn clean!!!!!LOL!!!

[Mike Phillips]

Re: color sanding and all that good stuff by hand

Where we at with this?