Is it possible to finish with a foamed wool pad and M105?

[10degreesbtdc]

As you may have seen, I completed a Exterior only on a white BMW recently and used M105 on purple foamed wool pad. I've also used this on my truck. I am very pleased with the resulting shine!

However, after talking with another member he brought up a good point. How much micro marring am I leaving with this combo? On white and medium/light blue metallic, I can't see any. I'm wondering what the results would be on dark colors.

Is it possible to finish without marring using M105 and foamed wool? Or am I dillusional? I know I've seen many times where professonals are finishing with a wool pad on a rotary. Why can't I with wool on a Flex?

Maybe we can do a side-by-side with foamed wool and M105 against M105 on a soft buff polishing pad or against M205 on foamed wool at the Tampa meet to see the difference? Until then, or until I get a dark colored car to test it on, when there are lots of scratches, its' PFW for me!

I know Bounty, for one, should have someting to say on this subject.

[Tuck91]

Re: Is it possible to finish with a foamed wool pad and M105?

I would try to move down to something, such as M205 or even M80 on the D.A with a yellow polishing pad.

But I dont know for sure, I am not a pro.

[MrCLRider]

Re: Is it possible to finish with a foamed wool pad and M105?

I know that Nick has done it on an older Mercedes...if he can, why can't the rest of us?

[RDVT4ME]

Re: Is it possible to finish with a foamed wool pad and M105?

I would say that it is possible, but there are some variables.

Technique is very important, guys like Nick and Kevin are masters at that.

Another variable is the paint. Some paint just does not finish well even with good technique. It then requires a lesser degree of abrasiveness.

[10degreesbtdc]

Re: Is it possible to finish with a foamed wool pad and M105?

I know that Nick has done it on an older Mercedes...if he can, why can't the rest of us?

That's what I say!

I would say that it is possible, but there are some variables.

Technique is very important, guys like Nick and Kevin are masters at that.

Another variable is the paint. Some paint just does not finish well even with good technique. It then requires a lesser degree of abrasiveness.

I just can't see any marring in my truck's light/medium paint or around bottom indigo dark blue. With my 1000 watt halogens I couldn't see any one the white BMW either. I plan to do a test spot on my S10's dark red pearl and see what's what. I'll try to get some decent photos, can't guarantee anything with my old camera.

[Bounty]

Re: Is it possible to finish with a foamed wool pad and M105?

I know Bounty, for one, should have someting to say on this subject.

You knew I was coming, brother...

To be honest, the test section is such an important part of the process that we can sometimes take it as gospel. What worked on one small section of paint may or may not be 100% repeatable around the car and the remaining painted panels with various degrees of film thickness, defects, etc.

That being said, on certain test sections of traditionally harder paint surfaces (GM Premium, Mercedes CeramiClear, etc) that are light in color I have finished close to LSP-ready with a PFW/Flex/M105 combination. The forced rotational aspect of the Flex allows this to be possible versus the "scrubbing" action alone of the PC7424's and G110's of the world. Being that white, silver, and similar color shades mask defects so well it could be very likely any light marring just can't be seen easily when finished this way and the LSP masks or fills what remains for a great look with just one step.

Softer paints like certain Honda, Toyota, and Hyundai need a delicate touch to finish out perfectly and I don't have the experience to do so with a PFW on a Flex. Some might, but I've never had to use a PFW on a Honda yet....CCS Orange/M105 on a Flex gets it all out for me so far. Darker paints which easily display defects also rarely seem to finish out LSP ready with just one pass. My particular problem is that I deal with so many Audi's, BMW's, and Benz's from my lease return packages that I've been accustomed to paint surfaces that are exceptionally hard and at the same time very scratch-sensitive. This usually means the pressure/pad/product cobination required to get out all the defects imparts it's own induced marring.

I think a side-by-side comparison would be great and I think you know I'll be bringing the right vehicle for the job to Tampa...

[john m.]

Re: Is it possible to finish with a foamed wool pad and M105?

I know that Nick has done it on an older Mercedes...if he can, why can't the rest of us?

I think Nick has some kind of special powers that allow him to create crazy results

[TH0001]

Re: Is it possible to finish with a foamed wool pad and M105?

I would say that while you can get really good results with this combo, it is my opinion that you are better of finishing with a finishing pad. While you might not see the micromarring, it is still causing light to scatter.

If it doesn't make black perfect, it doesn't make any other color perfect, even if we cannot see the results. And yes, Nick does have magic powers

[Hemin8r]

Re: Is it possible to finish with a foamed wool pad and M105?

I would say that while you can get really good results with this combo, it is my opinion that you are better of finishing with a finishing pad. While you might not see the micromarring, it is still causing light to scatter.

If it doesn't make black perfect, it doesn't make any other color perfect, even if we cannot see the results. And yes, Nick does have magic powers

I agree. Next time you finish the combo you mentioned do a 50/50 test spot on a panel with a finishing pad. That should show you how much clearer the paint gets. Just a thought.

[10degreesbtdc]

Re: Is it possible to finish with a foamed wool pad and M105?

I agree. Next time you finish the combo you mentioned do a 50/50 test spot on a panel with a finishing pad. That should show you how much clearer the paint gets. Just a thought.

TH0001: If it doesn't make black perfect, it doesn't make any other color perfect, even if we cannot see the results. And yes, Nick does have magic powers

I still say, if Nick can do it, I can do it. It just might take awhile!

Great feedback guys. For the time restriction, price and results I'm happy. Of course I ALWAYS want it to be shinier, so I definitely will try a finishing pad next time with M105 or M205.

I did check results with an ISP wipe x 2 on many spots to confirm the PFW/M105 approach was, as far as I could tell with halogens and one overhead fluorescent light, mighty shiny! I tested on the rear quarter with halogens just over my shoulder and it looked nice, so off I went. I did not, however, pull it in the sun before M21. There just wasn't enough time before the owner's were home from work and if it wasn't as defect free as I thought, I didn't want to know about it.

Improved efficiency will allow more time to perform a second step if needed and check results under varied lighting conditions. My Brinkmann was dead, unfortunately. I also need to find time to take more before and after photos. I'll get it figured out.

Thanks everyone. Have a great weekend!

[cardriver]

Re: Is it possible to finish with a foamed wool pad and M105?

I always try to finish up with 205. It's so much easier, pleasing, and quicker (IMO) to work with than 105, so I don't see any harm in using it. It might add some time to your detail, but the finishing polish phase usually goes by pretty fast for me.

[InfiniteDetail]

Re: Is it possible to finish with a foamed wool pad and M105?

I have done it with pretty good success. Depends on the paint hardness, color, and desired result.

For example I wouldn't do it for a customer wanting a *perfect* finish. But I have done it for a customer that just wanted the paint cleaned up to sell and it came out very nice! Not perfect mind you, but more than acceptable for what the customer wanted and paid for.

So I guess the answer is "it depends"

[Garry Dean]

Re: Is it possible to finish with a foamed wool pad and M105?

Micromarring, yuck!

[Maserati Mario]

Re: Is it possible to finish with a foamed wool pad and M105?

I guess it's possible, if all the factors are right.

[Eddie6th]

Re: Is it possible to finish with a foamed wool pad and M105?

Detailing is an art.

This depends on the skill of the user.Using one machine,yes.Using one compound or polish,no.

As an example,look at those pro chinese chefs.They cut everything with one chopping knife!!Even intricate stuff!

Most people need to use a selection of different knives.