people actully wash with dawn?

[Tim Lingor]

Hey,

Here is a quote from Mike Phillips:

"Dawn is somewhat famous for it's strong detergent cleaning action enabling it to remove grease from dishes and pans. The idea being if it will remove grease, food and things like cooking oils from your dishes, it will be strong enough to do a stellar job of cleaning your paint before you begin a detailing session.

There is also a certain camp of people that recommend with a zeal, the use of Dawn to wash your car before the application of some paint protectants to insure some company's polymers will be able to bond to the finish.

The problem with using strong detergents to wash your car is that not only do high alkaline, strong detergent soaps like Dawn dull your car's paint and strip off wax/polymer protectants, it also dries out all of the non-paint components such as vinyl, rubber and plastic.

Meguiar’s car washes clean effectively, and more importantly, safely, so you don't have to resort to antiquated and harsh methods of cleaning your car, truck or s.u.v.

The finish on this neglected Mercedes-Benz could have been harmed even more than it already was had a strong detergent wash been used on it in it's current condition.



As you can see, the paint already looks much better after merely washing it with a Meguiar's car wash.



Richness, color and clarity have been increased. My own personal experience tell me washing paint as neglected as the paint on this car would have made it look worse, not better.

See the rest of this extreme makeover here,

Open Invitation - Mercedes-Benz Extreme Makeover

Hope this helps...

Mike

Tim

[Murr1525]

And one other oddity.. Why would Zaino need a perfectly clean surface for its cleaners to work? Did I miss something?

[mpmiller37]

Not sure why but Zaino says you won't get stellar results unless you strip the car clean, like with Dawn. They don't want you putting their product onto anything that may have contained oils (like polishes) or waxes.
Some people rave about Zaino and I used it some time ago without stripping the car, it looked ok but not great. Recently, I washed with dawn, clayed my car and applied Zaino Z5. The Z5 looked great except the clay put fine scratches on my black car. So I then applied Meg #9 swirl remover and scratchX to remove the scratches and these products didi a great job. I attempted to put a coat of Z5 on as a final step. I could not get the zaino off the finish and I was rubbing very hard, it freaked me out. Then I put some Zymol(a wax product) on it and got it off. Zymol is great at hiding imperfections on black cars. Now the finish looks good but in the sun i can notice distortions that look like smears in certain areas. I'm wondering if mixing all these products has caused this.
What Meguiars products are good for hiding imperfections on black cars and can give me long lasting protection like the paint sealants claim ??

[the other pc]

Originally posted by mpmiller37
You guys are bashing Dawn too much. It is useful...

I'm not bashing Dawn, I love the stuff and use it all the time on dishes.

...Many products on the market do not recommend mixing them with other products. For instance Zaino products. To achieve the full affect of some products, you must remove any other polishes, waxes, etc. that are on the surface before applying...

We're not arguing that that's not a good idea (sometimes) to clean down to fresh paint, only that Dawn is a poor way to do it. (And the makers of Dawn agree.)

... Car wash producst that have been mentioned don't do this but Dawn Dish washing detergent will...

Washes like NXT or Gold Class won't, they're made to preserve the finish and wax (unlike Dawn which preserves neither) but they will remove dirt very well. All the products I mentioned earlier, DC step 1, MPPC, CC body scrub, #80, #83 and others as well, will do it and will do it much better than Dawn.

... No one would recommend washing with Dawn unless the purpose was to strip all products from the paint surface to begin a detail from scratch...

I agree. But since Dawn does a pretty poor job of that why not use a product that's designed from scratch to do it and do it well? (And to preserve the paint finish too.)


PC.

[mpmiller37]

We're not arguing that that's not a good idea (sometimes) to clean down to fresh paint, only that Dawn is a poor way to do it.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
So if I want to strip down to paint without using any other cleaner or polish product, then what would I use ??

[Murr1525]

Well, Nxt tech wax has fillers in it to cover fine swirls. And mixing products from enough different companies could certainly leave a smear or two, where they didnt mix quite right. Nothing permanent at least.

As far as cleaning paint, the best thing to do is use a good car wash to get the loose dirt off, then use a clay bar to remove loose wax and stuck on contaminants. Then follow up with a dedicated paint cleaner, either chemical or abrasive, to remove any wax and get the dirt out of the paint pores.

This way, all 3 steps enhance the finish, without taking any steps backwards.

Quite frankly, using Dawn once isnt going to kill everything. But rubber and plastic trim will be affected more than paint, so with repeated uses, the trim will go much sooner than the paint. Delicate things like this are espeacialy important on older cars.

[the other pc]

Originally posted by mpmiller37
...So if I want to strip down to paint without using any other cleaner or polish product, then what would I use ??

I think Murr1525 summed it up well:

Originally posted by Murr1525
...As far as cleaning paint, the best thing to do is use a good car wash to get the loose dirt off, then use a clay bar to remove loose wax and stuck on contaminants. Then follow up with a dedicated paint cleaner, either chemical or abrasive, to remove any wax and get the dirt out of the paint pores....

This way you're using products that do each step effectively.

There isn't any single product available that removes loose dirt and grit, bonded contaminants and wax anywhere near as effectively and safely as dedicated products.

To remove loose dirt and grit you want a very high lubricity wash to avoid scratching. Many bonded contaminants are removed better by clay than any chemical product. To remove wax you need something that will actually dissolve it (or break its chemical bond with the surface). These are very different chemical/physical operations.

If you don't want to use anything with any oils or waxes after claying you could use a solvent type chemical cleaner like Meguiar's Body Solvent. You'd still need to use some kind of cutting cleaner or polish if you have swirls, etching, oxidation or deep stains.


PC.