Passion Hurts

[Poki]

Re: Passion Hurts

I'm thinking about a orbital from sears. $40 and i've seen great results at the showcardetailing forum. This is a 7" orbital, they have a 6" version. What size pads are more popular?

http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_1...0721000P?mv=rr

The Sears orbitals are better than hand work but I would not recommend them because: I have gone through 3 of them in just a couple years of limited use! The pads come apart after a few uses and Sears has no replacement parts/pads making these machines disposable. I just got my G110 and there is NO comparison to the results!! The DA machine is many many times better than an orbital. Wait until you can afford the G110 and you'll be happy you did.

[pwaug]

Re: Passion Hurts

But lets face it, any amount of detailing is going to make that paint look far better than not doing it! Plus, when we see our cars/trucks etc looking awesome, there is a certain amount of pride to be had knowing that you made that happen!

Tim

Tim--you hit the nail on the head! Most of my friends and neighbors think I'm crazy when they see me washing my car by hand in the winter and spending a whole day giving it a complete detail every three or four months. It is amazing at the number of people who think cars no longer need polishing and waxing-- they think the clear coat paints don't require any special care. I've managed to convert some of them over when they see their cars next to mine or if I conduct a little experiment for them--when they think their cars are in top shape I'll do a small section of the hood with a claybar--that has converted many of them over when they see what the clay picks up. Once they put in the time they are smiling from ear to ear. I think it's great just to get them doing something to keep the paint in better shape even if it's not the ultimate.

[MadCow]

Re: Passion Hurts

thanks for the replys guys. I'm going skip the orbitals and I'm instead going to save up for a much nicer PC. Mabye I can find one used for a good deal .

[Tim Lingor]

Re: Passion Hurts

Tim--I'm just an enthusiast so certainly don't have the knowledge or experience of you and others on the forum. However, a neighbor of mine bought the 6" Sears Orbital (I tried to talk him into a DA) and used it with 3M Perfectit II Light Cut Rubbing Compound followed by M80 on a 10 year old car with CC. He used terry bonnets. I was really surprised at the quality of the results--almost all of the swirls were gone and deeper scratches were done by hand. He said he was able to put some pressure on the unit without it bogging down. All in all I was impressed with the results--certainly not a professional job but totally acceptable for a daily driver and much better than when he started.

That's cool! My point was not to say, do not buy one. If that is all one can afford, then that is just fine. Just getting out and detailing the paint is awesome!! I was also just wanting to make sure that people did not get disillusioned expecting perfection when using the orbital. Sometimes one must work within our means, not just with our skill level but also our equipment and monetary levels. But lets face it, any amount of detailing is going to make that paint look far better than not doing it! Plus, when we see our cars/trucks etc looking awesome, there is a certain amount of pride to be had knowing that you made that happen!

Tim

[Ivan Rajic]

Re: Passion Hurts

It's perfectly fine to try machines you have available or can afford, as for various compounds and bonnets... it's simple really... before you go over the entire car just do a test spot first, make sure your choice of pads/bonnets and products is working in this one small area, that it that it's making the paint look good.

If it's not, at least you only have a small are to fix.

+1 and always go with the "Least aggressive method first"... unless you've done 50 cars with almost 30 different types and colors of paint, you won't be able to pick up 2 pads and 2 products and say this is what I need for a 2-step... even know I, along with many others I believe, try stuff out for a good 30-60 minutes to get the best combo for the best results.

[Mike Phillips]

Re: Passion Hurts

It's perfectly fine to try machines you have available or can afford, as for various compounds and bonnets... it's simple really... before you go over the entire car just do a test spot first, make sure your choice of pads/bonnets and products is working in this one small area, that it that it's making the paint look good.

If it's not, at least you only have a small are to fix.

[pwaug]

Re: Passion Hurts

Just to chime in and to prevent misinformation...

Using more aggressive compounds require a more powerful machine as the diminishing abrasives need the mechanical energy to break them down. Hence the reason a heavy duty compound requires a rotaries direct drive action and power from its motor, as even the G-110's 4.2 amp's motor and action is not enough for them.

Secondly, though the specs of the model you suggest appear fine, once that pad touches the paint, that 1 amp motor will slow down considerably making the break down of the abrasives all but impossible except for the lightest cleaners. Paint correction takes both knowledge and the correct tools for the job.

In the end, it is like I said in my above post, you need the correct tool to do the job. A mechanic's tool chest is full of tools as different tools are required for different jobs. Can other tools work, sure... but to a certain extent only. But we do not want people disillusioned that using a regular orbital will do moderate paint correction when really a more dedicated tool is required.

Tim

Tim--I'm just an enthusiast so certainly don't have the knowledge or experience of you and others on the forum. However, a neighbor of mine bought the 6" Sears Orbital (I tried to talk him into a DA) and used it with 3M Perfectit II Light Cut Rubbing Compound followed by M80 on a 10 year old car with CC. He used terry bonnets. I was really surprised at the quality of the results--almost all of the swirls were gone and deeper scratches were done by hand. He said he was able to put some pressure on the unit without it bogging down. All in all I was impressed with the results--certainly not a professional job but totally acceptable for a daily driver and much better than when he started.

[Tim Lingor]

Re: Passion Hurts

I've heard that it will accept the backing plate used on the PC which would allow you to use the same pads used with a PC if you wanted to. The 6" would allow more pressure to be applied. Also, it appears to be a little more powerful than most of the cheap orbitals as it has a 1 amp motor and 3800 orbits per minute. I've never used it--just making these observations from reading posts. It seems to me that if you used a more aggressive polish (to a point) the orbital would be more successful in removing defects.

Just to chime in and to prevent misinformation...

Using more aggressive compounds require a more powerful machine as the diminishing abrasives need the mechanical energy to break them down. Hence the reason a heavy duty compound requires a rotaries direct drive action and power from its motor, as even the G-110's 4.2 amp's motor and action is not enough for them.

Secondly, though the specs of the model you suggest appear fine, once that pad touches the paint, that 1 amp motor will slow down considerably making the break down of the abrasives all but impossible except for the lightest cleaners. Paint correction takes both knowledge and the correct tools for the job.

In the end, it is like I said in my above post, you need the correct tool to do the job. A mechanic's tool chest is full of tools as different tools are required for different jobs. Can other tools work, sure... but to a certain extent only. But we do not want people disillusioned that using a regular orbital will do moderate paint correction when really a more dedicated tool is required.

Tim

[pwaug]

Re: Passion Hurts

http://www.showcardetailing.com/foru...ead.php?t=1225

I'm still thinking about a PC or something. Mabye the pawn shop would be a good place to look, I haven't searched long on the net for a nice one that is used though. I know makita has to have a nice unit. How can I tell if a random orbital will be nice and powerful or not?

Thanks for the link! If you do go for the Orbital take a look at this Sears 6" http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_1...bital+polisher

I've heard that it will accept the backing plate used on the PC which would allow you to use the same pads used with a PC if you wanted to. The 6" would allow more pressure to be applied. Also, it appears to be a little more powerful than most of the cheap orbitals as it has a 1 amp motor and 3800 orbits per minute. I've never used it--just making these observations from reading posts. It seems to me that if you used a more aggressive polish (to a point) the orbital would be more successful in removing defects.

[MadCow]

Re: Passion Hurts

Tim

That paint looks terrible, i'm sorry to say this but this the worst paint I have ever seen. Hahahahah no i'm joking, someone should ban me for saying that. I didn't think a ford could have that nice of a paint job. Makes me really want a g110 or something, wow. I'm going to start seriously looking at a PC or something tomorrow. Thanks for sharing your pictures!

[RamAirV1]

Re: Passion Hurts

I have never had much in the way of results with a cheap orbital, they are just too weak. And after having used a rotary, the PC seems inefficient for moderate swirls. So now I am tempted to add the G-110!

Tim, I have to say that the first time I saw that F-150 detail, I dediced that I just had to have a rotary! It was just a matter of time. The sun pretty much shows all swirls in my experience. If you look at the paint from all angles you will see all the swirls if there are any. But there are not any at all on that F-150s paint.

If an orbital can remove swirls from a paint surface, they probably weren't that bad to begin with, and they probably could have been removed by hand IMHO.

RamAirV1

[kellyinkc]

Re: Passion Hurts

I agree with Tim here, he has been detailin' LONGER than some have been alive.
The Sears is OK to apply wax but swirl removal requires a PC or a rotary buffer.
Paint becomes like glass using a rotary!!

Kelly

[Tim Lingor]

Re: Passion Hurts

http://www.showcardetailing.com/foru...ead.php?t=1225

I'm still thinking about a PC or something. Mabye the pawn shop would be a good place to look, I haven't searched long on the net for a nice one that is used though. I know makita has to have a nice unit. How can I tell if a random orbital will be nice and powerful or not?

There is no substitute for using the correct tool for the job. An orbital is good for applying a wax. But for true paint correction a DA like the G-110 or a rotary polisher are required. If you want to remove swirls without a machine, your hand is actually stronger than an orbital, IMHO.

Swirl removal is paint dependant. Some paints, like SS paints or 'soft' clears, swirls are easily removable. But after detailing for over 25 years, I can assure you, nothing replaces a good rotary or a good DA polisher. An orbital simple does not have the power to do paint correction unless it is the most workable paint, which most modern BC/CC are not; they are usually as 'hard' as glass.

The Porter Cable (PC) 7424, 7336, the Meguiar's G-110 are all strong units with enough power to do moderate paint correction.

You can tell a rotary and DA buffed paint finish. Here is a "red panel" I did using the rotary followed by the G100 DA polisher with the results shown under direct sunlight (a dual Xenon light may help, but direct sunlight shows it all):







Tim



Tim

[MadCow]

Re: Passion Hurts

http://www.showcardetailing.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1225

I'm still thinking about a PC or something. Mabye the pawn shop would be a good place to look, I haven't searched long on the net for a nice one that is used though. I know makita has to have a nice unit. How can I tell if a random orbital will be nice and powerful or not?

[pwaug]

Re: Passion Hurts

[quote=MadCow;225184]I'm thinking about a orbital from sears. $40 and i've seen great results at the showcardetailing forum. This is a 7" orbital, they have a 6" version. What size pads are more popular?

Do you have a link to the results on showcardetailing?