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Thread: Help Required ! Synthetic Sealant + Light Wax

          
  1. #11
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    Re: Help Required ! Synthetic Sealant + Light Wax

    So I should then use White wax first , and then the sealant.. ??
    To use the products which i,ve already purchased.
    Because i cant buy 26 at the moment..

  2. #12
    Registered Member jankerson's Avatar
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    Re: Help Required ! Synthetic Sealant + Light Wax

    Quote Originally Posted by Ehsan4808 View Post
    So I should then use White wax first , and then the sealant.. ??
    To use the products which i,ve already purchased.
    Because i cant buy 26 at the moment..


    Yes, you will need to use the White Wax 1st because the White Wax would remove the Sealant.

  3. #13
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    Re: Help Required ! Synthetic Sealant + Light Wax

    Gr8.. Thanks bro.. Tomorrow all would be done.
    Wash
    Clay
    Wash
    UC
    White Wax
    Sealant

  4. #14
    Registered Member jankerson's Avatar
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    Re: Help Required ! Synthetic Sealant + Light Wax

    Quote Originally Posted by Ehsan4808 View Post
    Gr8.. Thanks bro.. Tomorrow all would be done.
    Wash
    Clay
    Wash
    UC
    White Wax
    Sealant

    Should work out really well for you.

  5. #15
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    Re: Help Required ! Synthetic Sealant + Light Wax

    Thanks.

  6. #16
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    Re: Help Required ! Synthetic Sealant + Light Wax

    Quote Originally Posted by Please Wash Me Detailing View Post
    21 is a cross-linked polymer sealant that takes 24 to set up.
    When using it you just apply, let it haze and wipe off.
    I advise my customers to not touch their car for 24 hours. Is this necessary? not really but some people will drive there car after a detail, get it filthy and wash it. So it might interrupt the cross-linking processor, in theory. So better safe then sorry.

    As for topping it? Waste of time and money. I never do this and never will.
    Out of the thousands of cars I've done if I multiplied that by 2 or even 3 times, that adds up to a lot of product and time wasted on a "slight" improvement that no one will notice.

    The biggest thing in making paint shine is getting it flat. Put your time into polishing and not waxing.
    Waxes and sealant are only there for protection and to ad gloss.
    Please wash me. Can you expand on the getting it flat and polishing it comment. I am interested in hearing more what you mean? You can pm me your answer if you choose? Thanks.

  7. #17
    Administrator Michael Stoops's Avatar
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    Re: Help Required ! Synthetic Sealant + Light Wax

    Quote Originally Posted by ShineOCD View Post
    Please wash me. Can you expand on the getting it flat and polishing it comment. I am interested in hearing more what you mean? You can pm me your answer if you choose? Thanks.
    What he is talking about is the fact that the vast majority of gloss will come from the prep steps rather than the wax itself. You plan on claying and using Ultimate Compound - these are the steps that make the paint "flat" as he calls it. Gloss comes from smoothness and flatness - a paint that has a lot of bonded contaminants on the surface and/or a lot of swirl marks is not "flat" by any means and so the gloss will be reduced. As you know, claying removes the bonded contaminants and UC removes the below surface defects, and together they create a smooth or "flat" paint surface that gives maximum reflectivity and gloss. If the car is a dark color you may want to enhance this gloss even further with the application of a polish, like either Ultimate Polish or M205, prior to waxing. On lighter colors you may not notice the difference quite as much. Further, both White Wax and M21 have some polish in them, so either one would make a dedicated polish step even more redundant.

    There is no real need to use both White Wax and M21 once the paint has been fully prepped with clay and UC. We would stick with a coat of M21 and then apply a second the next morning if that fits into your time schedule. You could then use White Wax a few months later as an all in one prep prior to applying M21 again. If you clay and UC to the point of creating a very high gloss and removal of the majority of defects, then a few months down the road the car may need just a light prep, and White Wax would be great for that.

    Lastly, we want to clarify the difference between "drying time" and "curing time" for a synthetic sealant like M21. Drying time is the time it takes for the product to dry to a haze on the surface after application. Depending on ambient conditions this could be anywhere from 10 minutes to 30 minutes or more. Lower temperatures and/or higher humidity will prolong drying tie. Curing time is the time it takes the product to fully cross link and bond to the paint surface after the excess has been removed. Again, this can vary depending on ambient conditions, and you can even see this by shining a light directly onto the paint and wiping the surface with a clean microfiber towel: you'll get a streaking or smearing appearance in the reflection of the light at first, but several hours later that smear will be much shorter in length and you might even be able to watch that smear disappear while looking at it. This is due to the polymers still being a bit dynamic on the surface during the curing process, and becoming less and less so as they continue to link.
    Michael Stoops
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    (800) 854-8073 xt 3875
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    Remember, this hobby is supposed to be your therapy, not the reason you need therapy.

    Please post technical questions directly to the forum rather than emailing or PM-ing me. You
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    Since this appears to be an active post, (I'm having some trouble with my phone in trying to do a proper search) I'm going to piggy back a relative question on here discussing m21.
    1. I've built up some excitement about m21, the research suggests when looking for the best performing protection, this would be my choice. Not only does it seem like this offers the longest protection compared to waxes and other sealants, but in some's opinion the best preferred added gloss to a well prepped surface.
    I finally found a local Meguiar's dealer down the street from me, and was surprised to find he did not carry m21 in stock, as he has almost all professional Meguiar's products, even specialty stuff that might get used rarely. I told him I was really looking forward to buying m21 to try out/start using on customers that are concerned with the "best protection".

    His response to me was and I'm paraphrasing, perhaps exaggerating, but this is the gist of what I understood from him "I've been detailing cars for 20+ years, I own 30 mini stations at dealerships across the county, I've always used Meguiar's. M20 is the exact same thing as m21, except it has small cutting properties, but more importantly its very easy to wipe off. M21 wipes off greasy and leaves streaks that undo that perfect look you want. I will never carry M21 because it is a pointless product.

    This made me sad. I bought neither product yet. I want to hear what y'all have to say about it.

    2. Is either of the detail line express waxes (I believe D156, D157) fit for actual DETAILS. I know we all wax to protect, but we also like that added benefit of enhanced gloss, even if its slight. I guess the question is, to save time, if I'm working a car that had obviously been then care of well and doesn't need polish, just a wash/wax, would these add to the gloss the same a any other traditional wax, I mean, there has to be a reason its "express wax" and its cheaper. I guess in the few scenarios I'd be using it, it would be for work I do for a dealership where I don't care as much about if its actually protected, the main goal is that it looks really awesome for at least a week with minimal effort/time put in. Because if it doesn't sell, I'll be washing it soon again anyway.

  9. #19
    Registered Member Murr1525's Avatar
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    Re: Help Required ! Synthetic Sealant + Light Wax

    I told him I was really looking forward to buying m21 to try out/start using on customers that are concerned with the "best protection".
    M20 and M21 are not the same at all.... and if I wanted best protection, I would pick Ult. Wax. But to say #21 is hard to use is nonsense.

    2. Is either of the detail line express waxes (I believe D156, D157) fit for actual DETAILS. I know we all wax to protect, but we also like that added benefit of enhanced gloss, even if its slight. I guess the question is, to save time, if I'm working a car that had obviously been then care of well and doesn't need polish, just a wash/wax, would these add to the gloss the same a any other traditional wax, I mean, there has to be a reason its "express wax" and its cheaper. I guess in the few scenarios I'd be using it, it would be for work I do for a dealership where I don't care as much about if its actually protected, the main goal is that it looks really awesome for at least a week with minimal effort/time put in. Because if it doesn't sell, I'll be washing it soon again anyway.
    Well... that is most of the issue... trading off time, versus best results.

    If you car is in good shape, esp a daily driver.... a cleaner/wax + wax is very often a great detail. Not too long, but great results.

    The quick, spray, express products work even better when it is used as a booster wax, over a surface that was already detailed.
    '08 Subaru Legacy 2.5i SE - Newport Blue Pearl

  10. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Murr1525:541319
    M20 and M21 are not the same at all.... and if I wanted best protection, I would pick Ult. Wax. But to say #21 is hard to use is nonsense.
    Thanks for both responses! Yeah I think I'm gonna buy the express spray on stuff got the no-brainers. I especially like that it says you can start applying before car is fully dry, big time saver.

    Re-question what I quoted you above, maybe I just misunderstood the way you worded it. I thought M21 being a "professional line"series and an actual polymer sealant is better protection than just UW. UW is a syn blend, correct?, while M21 (professional version of NXT) is fully synthetic and meant to "bond"with the paint for longest/most durable?

    And double-thank you on confirming my doubts about what that guy said of M21. If he doesn't want to carry that product, then I guess he won't get my sale for it as I'll order it online.

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