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Thread: Wax then seal, or seal then wax and where does cleaner/wax fit in?

          
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    Wax then seal, or seal then wax and where does cleaner/wax fit in?

    I hope to make this fairly brief yet ask my question(s) clearly. I have an '11 Malibu in Red Jewel Tintcoat. Beautiful color, I feel, and I need to keep it that way. In the past 20 years, I've had all white vehicles. Up until negelecting the detailing hobby as I did for the last 12 years, I used Mirror Glaze #6 mixed 50/50 with #26. At the time I was happy with the results, I also had more time to do the job more often and the car was garaged. Now, time is not as available as I'd like so my 'waxing' regimen needs to be as close to one step as possible yet last a bit longer than 6 to 8 weeks as it did with my last product mix.

    I just did the car this weekend, for now still using the 6/26 mix as I did before. I figured something is better than nothing. The car sits outside, at least for now, and is a daily driver. When I wash, which is every time it rains, and that's fairly often, I use plain water, no soap of any kind. Wash with a microfiber mitt, rinse and dry it off with a microfiber towel.

    Over time, a film used to form on the white car and the use of the 6/26 mix seemed to clean the film off and I feel the need to do that even now with the red color. Now, after my second waxing of the car, the color is better than new in the sunlight so I must have done something right. I would like to keep the paint better protected and was going to use #21 on it this weekend after I washed the car. Then, I thought of using Ultimate Liquid Wax and ran this by a fellow on another forum and he said I had it all backwards. He said to use the Ultimate Liquid, then use the 26 straight or the 6/26 mix.

    So could the members please set me straight on which way to go here. Is there a product that achieves somewhat the same goal as the #6 yet won't leave a residue on the nooks and crannies? Is there a benefit to using the #21, the ULW or another synthetic product in conjuction with a carnauba product, even if it does end up being two steps? I've seen mention of a cure time of 12 hours but am not sure of the side effects of dew during that period. Here on the east coast, dew is a fact of life. I'll have more questions but I know we're supposed to keep the questions per post to three. Thank you in advance for the advice.

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    Registered Member Murr1525's Avatar
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    Re: Wax then seal, or seal then wax and where does cleaner/wax fit in?

    I hope to make this fairly brief yet ask my question(s) clearly. I have an '11 Malibu in Red Jewel Tintcoat. Beautiful color, I feel, and I need to keep it that way. In the past 20 years, I've had all white vehicles. Up until negelecting the detailing hobby as I did for the last 12 years, I used Mirror Glaze #6 mixed 50/50 with #26. At the time I was happy with the results, I also had more time to do the job more often and the car was garaged. Now, time is not as available as I'd like so my 'waxing' regimen needs to be as close to one step as possible yet last a bit longer than 6 to 8 weeks as it did with my last product mix.
    No need to mix the products.

    I just did the car this weekend, for now still using the 6/26 mix as I did before. I figured something is better than nothing. The car sits outside, at least for now, and is a daily driver. When I wash, which is every time it rains, and that's fairly often, I use plain water, no soap of any kind. Wash with a microfiber mitt, rinse and dry it off with a microfiber towel.
    Definately want to use some soap, and the best technique possible. The Meguiars soaps are very mild, so affecting the wax layer as little as possible while removing the loose dirt. But perhaps more importantly, provides lubrication to the mitt and dirt sliding across the surface, to prevent swirls as much as possible.

    http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...6069207401372#

    Over time, a film used to form on the white car and the use of the 6/26 mix seemed to clean the film off and I feel the need to do that even now with the red color.
    Well, with no soap, the dirt was certainly left behind. And then the cleaners in the Cleaner/Wax would help remove it.

    Now, after my second waxing of the car, the color is better than new in the sunlight so I must have done something right. I would like to keep the paint better protected and was going to use #21 on it this weekend after I washed the car. Then, I thought of using Ultimate Liquid Wax and ran this by a fellow on another forum and he said I had it all backwards. He said to use the Ultimate Liquid, then use the 26 straight or the 6/26 mix.
    What I would want to do, and this is just my opinion, is put an extra step or two in at the start, and you will have longer results along the way.

    1. Wash - as shown in video
    2. Clay - Smooth Surface Clay kit - this is nice to do once or twice a year, and is pretty easy and quick when starting new.
    3. #6 or Colorx
    4. Wax - I find the Ult. Liq Wax lasts the longest for me so far. You could of course just stop after the Cleaner/wax, but the extra step will add more durability, etc.

    Then, in the future, you would just:
    1. Wash - as above
    2. Maintain - Ult Quick Wax. Great to apply while drying, so no extra time either.

    My car still beads water, looks good, and cleans up easy, and I did the above detail back in November. I have washed it 1-2 times a month since with UQW after. Starting to show some wear, but not bad yet. Might make the spring with no mid-winter detail.

    So could the members please set me straight on which way to go here. Is there a product that achieves somewhat the same goal as the #6 yet won't leave a residue on the nooks and crannies?
    Goign to want to keep any wax off the trim, and not force it into the body panels.

    Is there a benefit to using the #21, the ULW or another synthetic product in conjuction with a carnauba product, even if it does end up being two steps?
    I would find the most benefit in the #21 or ULW with a cleaner/wax.

    However, if you are used to caking on a lot of product, you will have to really work on getting thinner coats with the ULW. It works reaaly well, but if you put it on thick, you wont be happy removing it.

    I've seen mention of a cure time of 12 hours but am not sure of the side effects of dew during that period. Here on the east coast, dew is a fact of life.
    Ehh, not enough for me to care about. My car is outside all the time as well.

    I'll have more questions but I know we're supposed to keep the questions per post to three. Thank you in advance for the advice.
    You may be the only person ever to read that.... don't worry about it.
    '08 Subaru Legacy 2.5i SE - Newport Blue Pearl

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    Registered Member Poki's Avatar
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    Re: Wax then seal, or seal then wax and where does cleaner/wax fit in?

    After following Murr's suggestions...that red jewel will really POP with occasional wipes with Meg's Detailer line Synthetic X-Press Spray Wax. It is soooo easy to use and makes colors, especially dark and metallic paint actually look wet! I can give my car a total wax in 15 minutes. Go ahead and apply it to the black trim and even the glass!! Wipes off with no residue, shines and protects too. This is one of the most under estimated products we have.
    Barry

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    Administrator Michael Stoops's Avatar
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    Re: Wax then seal, or seal then wax and where does cleaner/wax fit in?

    Mat's suggestions are pretty much spot on so you'll do well to follow them.


    A couple of things to consider, though. Sealants are really just synthetic waxes so you don't really need to use both. One or the other will suffice, but sealants will tend to last longer and protect better than traditional waxes do. Even though you don't need to use both, many people like to as they feel they're getting the best of both worlds when doing so. In those cases, the common practice is to apply the synthetic product first (Ultimate Wax, NXT Tech Wax 2.0, M21 Synthetic Sealant, etc) and then top with a carnauba wax (M26, Gold Class, etc). What you never want to do, however, is to apply a cleaner wax like M06 over your sealant because it will remove most of the sealant you just applied. It is, after all, a cleaner wax.

    As for washing with plain water, that's actually not a very good idea. We see it quite a bit, and over time it creates more problems than it could possibly cause. Water alone isn't all that great at dislodging stuck on dirt, and it offers virtually zero lubrication in this context. A proper dilution of a quality car wash soap will not strip your wax, it will add the lubrication needed to prevent/reduce marring, and it has the emulsifiers and other ingredients needed to safely loosen and remove dirt and other contaminants from the paint. And since all of our car wash soaps are biodegradable, you don't have to worry about the runoff.
    Michael Stoops
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    Please post technical questions directly to the forum rather than emailing or PM-ing me. You
    will get a faster response on the forum, and your question could help someone else, too!


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    Re: Wax then seal, or seal then wax and where does cleaner/wax fit in?

    Thanks for the responses. Old habits will die hard, I did just buy a bottle of Ultimate Wash and Wax. I was doing a very dirty car and felt better using it. Now the quick detailer products while drying the car. The bottle doesn't mention it and this is the second time I've read it. Just spray it on the car, immediately after washing, while it's still wet? Then wipe it down like normal? What I have now will get me through this weekend. I'll do some more reading and I'm sure I'll be back with more questions. Thanks again for all the replies. I did watch the video. I kind of laughed at the grit guard but I see the point of having one. I'll add that to my list of goodies next shopping trip.

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    Registered Member Murr1525's Avatar
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    Re: Wax then seal, or seal then wax and where does cleaner/wax fit in?

    Thanks for the responses. Old habits will die hard, I did just buy a bottle of Ultimate Wash and Wax. I was doing a very dirty car and felt better using it.
    You're gettin' there...

    Now the quick detailer products while drying the car. The bottle doesn't mention it and this is the second time I've read it. Just spray it on the car, immediately after washing, while it's still wet? Then wipe it down like normal?
    I like to use the Ult. Quick Wax after washing, but the UQD is ok too. UQW is just a bit more durable, and needs a clean surface, so good after washing. Both are available in bulk sizes as well if you used a lot.

    As far as using them, I like to do a general quick wipe to get most of the water, not worrying about perfectly dry. And then go around with a second towel and UQW, and spray over everything while doing the final drying wipe.
    '08 Subaru Legacy 2.5i SE - Newport Blue Pearl

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