Seeking advice - future project?

[wifpd4]

Dear wise ones,

Today, I went to review this car as a potential project. Please offer suggestions, keeping in mind I don't have a rotary and will probably not buy one.

Part of this car is done and was done a year ago (fresh clear coat, 1500 sand, 3-M 3 step system). Some parts have just been sanded with 1500 grit.

I'm thinking of taking a louvered panel and working it over and having the owner judge the result before proceeding. The completed sections of the car are badly swirled, but all appear manageable.











Here is two parts, one after 1500 and the other after the owner has used a three step 3-M process after 1500.
The owner would like to stop at the 1500 and turn it over to someone else to finish it up.




This is the panel I'm thinking of taking as a sample to work on and get the owner's approval to proceed.



I look forward to your comments, concerns and suggestions.

Thank you.

[ADAuto]

Re: Seeking advice - future project?

Not a wise one here but that seems like it would be a nice project. I love newer cars but still think the classics were the best (minus that checkerboard firewall). I wish I grew up in a different era!! I am not positive if a pc would be able to work out the 1500 but I wouldn't be surprised especially with the new systems out now. The louves seem like they would be some work to get perfect but I am sure if you take your time on them they will come out great. Not sure how solid they are so just keep your pressure in check while working on them, would hate to see one bend. Would you have a time limit on it? If not, I would go for it. Take your time and am sure you will get great results. But as you said, ask the pro's.

[wifpd4]

Re: Seeking advice - future project?

AD, thanks for the interest and comments. Time is not a concern, the owner will give me a month and I can work at my own speed. I'm just afraid it's not do-able without a rotary.

[BillE]

Re: Seeking advice - future project?

Interesting David.

I'll just say, if you have the time, 'gopher it'. With winter (hate that word) coming on, good project.

Please keep us up to date on the process and results.

Bill

[Michael Stoops]

Re: Seeking advice - future project?

David, if you aren't going to use a rotary, and obviously this car is not the test bed for learning that tool, then you might want him to refine his sanding down to 3000 grit. At that point the DA Microfiber System just might get the job done for you, but aftermarket paint makes for an enormous range of variables. Taking that one panel as a demo piece is a very good idea, but one issue we see is sanding marks that look like they're right up to the edge of the piece. That can be tricky to buff out, and if he does it on some of the panels on this car you might have a real hard time getting the buffing pads into some of the tighter areas. The DA microfiber discs make that process easier due to their low profile configuration, but that still doesn't mean it will work overall. Still, we've seen plenty of evidence in favor of this process, so it's certainly worth a try. But the more he can refine those sanding marks the better off you'll be in the long run.

[wifpd4]

Re: Seeking advice - future project?

Bill, thanks for the interest. I started the test panel. Ugh lot of work.

Mike, you are correct many small and difficult places to work on, but the owner has stated he will remove fenders and doors if I desire. The goal would be to eliminate inside corners as much as possible. Get as close to being ready to wax or #80 if there is a chance paint is still off-gassing.

I didn't have any MFDA compounding pads as they were home in the wash. Although I was thinking not being a factory paint job might make MFDA less than desirable solution, so I used the ever popular and famous combo of 105-205. I started using 105 and a cyan colored Lake Country pad. The cyan pad feels like a hockey puck, but the thickness makes it less aggressive than anticipated. AFter cyan, I moved to 105 with a light green LC pad. After the 105, I switched to 205 using a LC of unknown color slightly less aggressive then the light green pad.

There was considerable work due to the louvers in the panel. I worked them by hand using 105 and then 205. I used the mini-buffer to work on the ends of the louvers, not so much as a buffer but more as a little pad holder.

The boundary of the one edge of the panel is too small to use even a 4" pad, so I though about the fiber pad in the headlight kit. Didn't work that well so I went back to hand work. However I switched to a microfiber applicator to gain just a little bit of aggression.

This all took too long and I hope to try the MFDA on another test panel and see if I can save some time. The owner does not wish to step up a grade or two in the sanding process.


Make shift work bench to prevent damage to panel.



The panel was placed on an 1 1/2" thick piece of foam to stabilized the panel and protect it from damage.
Holes were made in the foam to accommodate parts sticking out from panel.


The dull looking areas were sanded with 1500 grit.



First step in the process involved 105 and the square cut cyan colored Lake Country pad on the left.
Step two involved using 105 and the beveled cut light green LC pad on the right.
PC was set on speed 5, heavy pressure and slow arm speed.



The third step used 205 and a less aggressive LC pad first at speed 5 with heavy pressure and then speed 4
at light pressure.





The louvers were done by hand first using 105 and then 205. Some areas were worked by hand with a
microfiber applicator.



The corner of the microfiber towel points at an area that didn't polish out very well so I pulled out the
toy mini-buffer.



The mini-buffer comes with two pads on more aggressive. So I worked 105 then 205. The mini-buffer vibrates,
but makes a good method to hold a small applicator and manually work the small pad. Note the painter's mask paper
around the panel. Using a PC and pad around the edge started to pick up pieces of foam.


At one point I though using the fiber pad from the headlight restoration kit might be helpful. Not really.


105-205-finished product ready for owner review.


I will ask the owner to consider stepping up a grade of sand paper to make my job easier.

[BillE]

Re: Seeking advice - future project?

David,

Can you give more info on the 'mini'? Kinda like an 'electric toothbrush'?

Thanx...

Bill

[wifpd4]

Re: Seeking advice - future project?

Bill,
The mini-buffer is indeed like an electric toothbrush. I saw it at WalMart and bought as a potential joke, but have found it marginally useful in a couple of instances. It comes with a basic brush head, but it also has two accessory packs. One with an assortment of brushes such as conical and lug nut. The other pack has a pad holding attachment and two different pads. The white pad is a microfiber polishing/cleaning pad and the other is a blue colored, finer texture, microfiber finishing pad. The pad holder and pads mate up with Velcro.

The mini-buffer does not rotate, it oscillates back and forth. Not very much, more of a back and forth vibration. It's not very powerful, so don't purchase it thinking it's going to be useful. With the angled head it is a handy handle for the brushes or pads.

[BillE]

Re: Seeking advice - future project?

Thanx David.

I kinda thought it only oscillated, it was the (how to word this?) buffer looked like its' big brother is what caught my eye.

I've used an electric toothbrush, with 'child's extra soft' brush for getting the infamous leftover outa emblems, edges and the like.

Bill

[wifpd4]

Re: Seeking advice - future project?

Okay I met with the owner/painter and he agreed to take the sanding to 3000 grit before turning parts over to me.

I also asked what clear he used so I could ask you guys about it and perhaps find some information on the Internet that might prove helpful. The clear is PPG Concept 2021 Urethane. He also confirmed that the clear is nearly a year old, so I can use any products on it.

As we looked over the piece I thought I had completed, I started seeing swirls I was sure I had removed. This is after M105 twice with different pads, an IPA wipe down and M205 final buff. In addition to the swirls, there seems to be a haze. And I examined with a Brinkmann during each step.

What's up with that?

[wifpd4]

Re: Seeking advice - future project?

As a closing note, I didn't hear from anyone regarding this particular clear coat so I thought perhaps I was using a sledge hammer where a tack hammer would be better. I grabbed a bottle of SwirlX and followed it with a go-round of Ultimate Polish. Using the softest microfiber in my collection, I wiped off these compounds and got a swirl-free finish. A situation of delicate paint. So I'll need to tape off the ends of the louvers as I work back and forth on the lengths of the louvers to prevent inducing scratches on the perimeter of the panel. Then remove that tape and tape the ends of the louvers while working the flat perimeter areas. All the while being careful when switching between the front and back sides of the panel removing the product the "leaks" through the louvers during the process. At some point, finishing the panel while it's in place on the car as the final step.

Guaranteed to be losing proposition $ wise, but a priceless educational experience. Just what I need this winter.