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Thread: Bird Dropping Stains

          
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    Bird Dropping Stains

    What's the best way to remove stains from bird droppings, also best way to prevent. If I don't remove the droppings immediately, a stain is noticable from certain angles. I've tried Deep Polish and rewaxing and they are still there. I don't have the time to rmove them immediately...sometimes 6--8 hours on the paint is enough to stain!

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    Registered Member Murr1525's Avatar
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    Re: Bird Dropping Stains

    Well, the best protection would be from Nxt 2.0 Wax, but even that may not be enough. It sounds like your car is outside baking in the sun? That always speeds up the damage.

    As far as removing the marks, you would want to treat them like swirls, or any other minor scratch, here are some basic concepts:

    What it Means to Remove a Scratch

    How To Remove Swirls By Hand

    How To Remove a Bird Dropping Etching by Hand using M105 Ultra Cut Compound

    How to correctly apply ScratchX to remove swirls and scratches

    I would want to start with something mild like SwirlX, and then move up in strength to Ultimate Compound or #105 if needed.

    Deep Crystal Polish is only polishing oils, no cleaning ability or anything.
    '08 Subaru Legacy 2.5i SE - Newport Blue Pearl

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    Re: Bird Dropping Stains

    The car (2006 G35 w/20,000 miles) was a toy until 6 months ago and garaged more than it was driven. Now it's a daily driver and it's parked outside during the day now, and as you can guess, Houston is HOT! Droppings bake into the paint very fast. I don't park under trees or lights where they perch but the birds must love my color, light blue. I'm crazy about keeping it looking like new but don't have the time to mess with it all the time. I remove the droppings as soon as I find them but sometimes they're there awhile. Using Kwik Detailer, Deep Crystal Polish and Carnauba wax. They have worked in the past very well but don't seem to be the answer to the droppings.

    I only have 3-4 stains and it woild like to remove them. I found the droppings thread and the M105 looks like what I'm looking for. Your response seems to indicate it's an agressive cleaner. I don't want to make the situation worse by increasing the damage. How easy is it to use?

    Any idea on a stronger wax that can resist the dropping's acid?

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    Re: Bird Dropping Stains

    I have a car that has some bird droppings that would not come out I used some rubbing compound which made it look better.

    that bird dropping is some bad stuff. I bought a car cover it only takes a few minutes to put on there is always bird droppings on it but at least it doesn't get to the paint.

    Sometimes I feel like shooting birds.

    you can give the car cover a try

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    Registered Member Murr1525's Avatar
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    Re: Bird Dropping Stains

    I only have 3-4 stains and it woild like to remove them. I found the droppings thread and the M105 looks like what I'm looking for. Your response seems to indicate it's an agressive cleaner. I don't want to make the situation worse by increasing the damage. How easy is it to use?
    Watch the video about using ScratchX, where Mike is putting some passion behind the pad. You can start off applying the product gently, then work up to applying more passion as needed.

    You can also start out with a milder product like SwirlX if you want, and then step up to #105 if needed.

    SwirlX is a good general cleaner anyway when applied lighlty, so will be good for your regular use, and wont be a waste.
    '08 Subaru Legacy 2.5i SE - Newport Blue Pearl

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    Re: Bird Dropping Stains

    Bird Excrement

    Uric acid , C5H4N4O3 [a diprotic acid , thus in strong alkali at high pH it forms the dually charged full urate ion, but at biological pH or in the presence of carbonic acid or carbonate ions it forms the singly charged hydrogen or acid urate ion as its pKa2 is greater than the pKa1 of carbonic acid] [1]

    Bird excrement contains unpleasant fungi, including Histoplasma capsulatum and Cryptococcus neoformans as well as bacteria, including Chlamydophila psittaci. These are known to cause pneumonias as well as systemic infections.

    Various forms of encephalitis are also associated with bird droppings, avoid direct skin contact. It also contains highly acidic concentrates; uric acid, pH 3.0 - 4.5, Uric acid is a small organic compound which is produced by the breakdown of protein during digestion, and is excreted by reptiles and birds. Uric acid is also the end product of nitrogen catabolism in birds

    Their main food source in summer is mostly insects, in the winter/ spring it’s berries, which are very acidic, which if left for any length of time the will cause the porous clear coat to occlude (a non-transparent ‘clouded’ area) or may cause etching (a depression in the paint or glass surfaces) Birds use gravel to help digest their food so grit and sand are some of the major components, which can cause scratching.

    Heat acting as a catalyst, a vehicle paint surface temperature of >90.oF creates a very aggressive reactivity of the acids that are present, which causes surface etching, so they should be removed without delay, at lower temperatures (> 40.oF or less) there’ s no reactivity and therefore little or no etching.

    Protection- a polymer sealant forma a molecular bond with any paint surface it’s applied too, so when it’s attacked by environmental elements (acid rain, bird excrement, etc) it provides a direct conduit to the clear coat paint surface, causing surface etching.

    Carnauba wax molecules form a closed linked mesh like structure, which means that they only butt up together to protect the surface and the wax forms a shell like structure that adheres to the paint surface. When attacked by environmental elements they have to compromise the wax surface before they can reach the clear coat paint surface and cause surface etching.

    Most organic waxes (Carnauba) are more resistant to environmental hazards then synthetics, although an Acrylic polymer offers limited resistance. But the best way to avoid clear coat etching is too remove the environmental acid as soon as it’s noticed; but given enough time acid will compromise the clear coat whatever its protection.

    No wax or polymer sealant can provide a permanent shield against acidic bird excrement, even the latest nanotechnology coating, CeramiClear only offers resistance to scratches, mars and acid etch, a product like Collinite 845 Insulator Wax is probably the most durable non-organic wax product, and but this may only provide enough of a barrier to enable it to be removed quickly before causing too much damage to the paint film surface.

    Take your time and be careful with its removal, these acids should be removed and/or neutralized as quickly as possible. Using an IPA (isopropyl alcohol) no ammonia based (ammonia acts as an acid accelerant) glass cleaner or a gel alcohol hand cleaner (Purell®) place a small amount on to a first aid gauze pad and apply to effected area this will help it stay in place during the necessary dwell time. The alcohol content acts as a drying agent, which will extract the acid, then thoroughly flush with water to rinse away any grit or sand, etc or use detailers clay to encapsulate it, re-spray the area let it dwell for 2-3 minutes and wipe dry.

    Excrement Removal - to remove bird excrement without causing scratches; apply very little surface pressure, dusting with long strokes in one direction only, use a product that contains a surfactant; this will lessen surface scratching as they ‘lift’ dust etc into the media used avoiding surface friction (use a solution of Optimum no-rinse (ONR) diluted 1:20 / distilled water in a fine mist spray bottle) and allow to dwell as this will soften debris and allow it to be removed

    Use a long nap micro fibre towel to ensure the debris that is lifted from the paint surface remains in the nap and not on the towel surface thereby causing surface marring. Shake the towel occasionally to ensure any particles picked up will drop out rather than come to the surface while you’re using it.
    Do not scrub hardened/dried excrement residue, birds use gravel to help digest their food so grit and sand are some of the major components, which can cause scratching as it is very abrasive and will scratch the paint surface. Once it softened (re-liquefied) it enables their removal with less likelihood of damage to the paint surface Do not use on a hot paint surface (soon after driving) as this will cause streaking

    Neutralization - Sodium bicarbonate (baking soda); first ensure the surface is cool. Mix a small amount (about 1/2 cup) of baking soda and a little water to make a paste (with the consistency of pancake syrup).
    Spread it on the affected paint surface working it around well and let it sit for ½ hr. Remove, rinse and dry. The paint surface should be periodically neutralized / decontaminated (See also Paint Surface Decontamination)

    Avoid using a QD spray to flush residue, as they contain either carnauba wax or polymer sealants, which will seal the acid and not allow it to dissipate. Using an alkaline rinse of baking soda and water (to neutralize the acid) as soon as is practical is highly recommended, if the affected paintwork is not neutralized any remaining acid residue will be reactivated .If the paint or glass surface has been etched the surface can be levelled with a suitable polish (Zaino PC Fusion Dual Action Paint Cleanser and then apply a paint protection).

    Do not scrub hardened/dried excrement residue as it is very abrasive and will scratch the paint surface, once they are softened (re-liquefied) it enables their removal with less likelihood of damage to the paint surface

    If the paint can be rectified by chemical means (e.g. acid, concrete, water spotting, etc.) then this is the answer; not abrasive cleaning. Using the correct chemical cleaners will dissolve the contaminants rather than abrading the paint.

    The paint system is porous; when you add water and heat to an acidic substance it will erode the paint system very quickly (the heat opens microscopic fissures in the clear coat allowing ingress, the water provides a carrier system for the acid, and heat acts as a catalyst each time water is reintroduced the acid will be reactivated).

    Alternative product- this product will remove bird excrement without damage to both vinyl and cloth (convertible tops). It will not harm its water repellence. Poop-Off Bird Poop Remover is a non-toxic, biodegradable, active enzyme formula that removes droppings and residues composed of all types of avian diets including, seeds, fruit, nuts, meat, vegetables, nectar, bugs and grains. Originally a marine product, it will not harm the tops water repellence -PAC

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