Just What Difference Does A Wax Make? - A Test To Find Out!

[Kickin Griffin]

This thread brings together all of the posts I have made with regards to a test I organised and with the help of fellow detailers carried out in the summer of 2008 - my aim, to see if expensive waxes really are able to deliver an "extra" in finish.... My methods were simple: take 7 identical black Vauxhall Corsas, machine polish them to prepare them to the best look possible by machine, and then IPA the finish to have a blank canvas. Each car then received three layers of a wax, they were placed outside in the sun and inside to see if folk could tell a difference and spot the expensive waxes amongst the cheaper ones.... Here's the story:

Pictures from day 1 of the preparation, and these are the seven lucky Corsas parked up and waiting...









Not the cleanest, these are just out of storage so we do have our work cut out!!







So, we picked the dirtiest of the lot to get started with:





Bird bomb anyone?



Dust?





Nothing a good wash wont sort out...





Or will it - some serious etching here:





Well - it'll polish out

The car cleaned and clayed, ready for machining:







Doesn't look too bad, maybe a little dull... under the lights, you can see a dullness to the reflections:





And the etching:



While Harry cracked on with washing Corsa No. 2, I decided to see what we were going to need - and this is where the shock came: to get that finish back to sharp needed 3M Fast Cut Plus (two hits to get rid of the bird etching!! :doublesho)!! Got a sharpness back, left some light hologramming:





Cleaned up very nicely with 85RD Final Finish though, ready for wax - panel after IPA wipe:



Out in the sunlight you can see the difference the polishing has made... this car is the one Harely has just washed, no machining:









And this is the one that has been machined - you can see a sharpness returned to the paint, and a lovely gloss restored:









Indoors, we can see the difference too:

Unpolished:



Polished:



And now, the two cars sitting ready for tomorrow:







But still 5 left...





It'll be all hands on deck tomorrow!! :thumb:

[Kickin Griffin]

Re: Just What Difference Does A Wax Make? - A Test To Find Out!

After testing the water yesterday with the polishing and realising that we were going to need Fast Cut Plus to get rid of a peely haze on the paint, we knew we had out work cut out today!! The target was three cars machined to a finish...

So best crack on - some work in progress shots:






























Some befores from around the cars...








And some after compounding...












After finishing:






And we did make out target... 3 cars complete:




















Tucked away...

[Kickin Griffin]

Re: Just What Difference Does A Wax Make? - A Test To Find Out!

This will be the final thread of pics until after the event

Day 3 of the prep, and it started painfully for me... the gearbox on the Makita I was using yesterday got rather hot, and slowly burned my hand without realising it!...



So while I did a little first aid...



Neil sorted the Makita with a little modification:



Meanwhile, Gaz was killing his backing plate:





And ensuring I didn't steal his Last Touch :lol::





Work in progress pics:















Bryan from Drive & Shine came along to help today too, and did some Fast Cutting for us: many thanks!! :thumb::thumb:





They are armed and dangerous - rotaries, cutting pads, and Fast Cut!



Neil did some wet sanding on etching...





Polish out...



Bryan kept on washing...





Despite Gaz attacking him... :lol::lol:





A before and after shot by Gaz :thumb:





I ran away for a little while... to a bodyshop...



to play with a Sealey...



The back to work...





Oh heck, we killed Neil :doublesho



Blood, sweat and tears... but we're there!!











:thumb:

[Kickin Griffin]

Re: Just What Difference Does A Wax Make? - A Test To Find Out!

Well, we made it!! :thumb:

7 Corsas, machined with Fast Cut Plus and then finished to perfection with Menz 85RD. Then on with a set of LSPs, each one getting three layers, they will of course be revealed tomorrow... but for the time being, some teaser pics of the cars all complete and waiting for tomorrow's entertainment














































7 shiny bonnets (and indeed, 7 shiny cars as the whole cars were done!!):
















It certainly wasn't a breeze...




So happy we got there, its FAB:







:thumb:

[Kickin Griffin]

Re: Just What Difference Does A Wax Make? - A Test To Find Out!

The day of the meet!!

Some pics from throughout the day










































The "aftermath"... 7 shiny Corsas

[Kickin Griffin]

Re: Just What Difference Does A Wax Make? - A Test To Find Out!

And the looks results........

Disclaimer: the results in the thread represent the opinions and thoughts of those attending this wax test. They are not designed to be hard fact, but rather opinions shared by like minded enthusiasts based on the preparation and the thoughts of folks on the day. Please take these results with the fun that they are intended, and remember they represent opinion and not hard fact

Seven black sapphire three door Vauxhall Corsas were prepared identically - washed with Shampoo Plus, clayed with Bilt Hamber Soft Clay, compounded with 3M Fast Cut and finished to near perfection with Menzerna PO85RD Final Finish... Each car was then wiped down with IPA to ensure a blank canvas and then each car received three layers of an LSP (different on on each car), wiped down the following morning with purified water and rolled out into the sunlight for assessment on the day of the test.

For the first part of this thread, the cars were rolled out into the sun, wiped down and then photographed - apollogies for the slightly changing light in these shots, cannot be helped for outdoors as the sun was in and out - but a general idea can be gained here - spot a difference other than slightly changing lighting?!!

The cars:


Zaino Z2




















Swissvax Best of Show




















Collinite 915






















***** Royale


















Autoglym HD Wax
















Raceglaze 55





















And now, shiny bonnets test in more controlled lighting:

Zaino Z2








***** Royale








Swissvax Best of Show








Autoglym HD Wax








Raceglaze 55








Collinite 915








And now just for fun, some random shots of the cars parked up - spotting a difference in pictures is nigh on impossible, in the flesh it was still practically impossible!...















Now, to the numbers... everyone attending was asked to rank the cars in order of preference, from 1 - 6 (7th, car with no LSP ignored)... this then gave the cars a points tally as follows:

1st = 7pts, 2nd = 6pts, 3rd = 5pts, 4th = 4pts, 5th = 3pts, 6th = 2pts

Here's how the cars scored - not everyone attending fully filled in a form, owing to not being able to see any difference at all... but these are the results we have:

Zaino Z2: 3rd, 2nd, 6th, 1st, 4th, 5th, 3rd, 5th, 4th, 5th, 4th = 46pts

***** Royale: 5th, 3rd, 1st, 6th, 5th, 1st, 3rd, 2nd, 6th, 3rd, 5th = 48pts

Swissvax Best of Show: 2nd, 5th, 2nd, 5th, 3rd, 4th, 1st, 1st, 1st, 2nd, 1st = 61pts

Autoglym HD Wax: 4th, 4th, 5th, 4th, 2nd, 3rd, 6th, 6th, 3rd, 1st, 3rd = 47pts

Raceglaze 55: 6th, 6th, 4th, 2nd, 6th, 2nd, 2nd, 3rd, 5th, 4th, 6th = 42pts

Collinite 915: 1st, 1st, 3rd, 3rd, 1st, 6th, 3rd, 4th, 2nd, 6th, 2nd = 56pts


These are the accurate scores:

1st: Swissvax Best of Show = 61pts
2nd: Collinite 915 = 56pts
3rd: ***** Royale = 48pts
4th: Autoglym HD Wax = 47pts
5th: Zaino Z2 = 46pts
6th: Raceglaze 55 = 42pts

What I will say is this though - every wax recieved a whole variety of placings which leads me to believe personally that its all in the eye of the beholder and the above results while they show a little consistency for the top two, for the last four there's nothing but random variation. As one would expect.

Again, I stress these results and this test are purely for fun and no serious conclusions should be drawn.

Guys - its all in the prep!! :thumb:

[Kickin Griffin]

Re: Just What Difference Does A Wax Make? - A Test To Find Out!

Okay folks, the looks results really are down to what people who were there on the day and saw the cars in the flesh thought as you cannot really capture any differences (arguably there weren't any!) in a picture... However, beading and sheeting you can so its here I would like people to vote and have their say on what they prefer!!

Now, a note to those who attended the wax test, the beading and sheeting videos which follow are different to the ones you saw on the day, as a dirty microfibre towel used on a couple of the cars was traced to leaving smearing on the bonnet just before the water tests, which will have adversely affected the water test results (but not the looks results, as the cars were wiped down in prep for the water test). So I have redone all of the videos again after giving the bonnets a wipe down with deionised water and a clean microfibre towel, which cured the beading and sheeting nicely For fun, a fourth layer of each LSP was added before this water test as well.

On viewing the videos and pictures below, please can you indicate which you prefer in order... try to avoid bias here please folks, have your say and judge fairly


Zaino Z2








Raceglaze 55








Autoglym High Definition Wax








***** Royale








Swissvax Best Of Show








Collinite 915

[Kickin Griffin]

Re: Just What Difference Does A Wax Make? - A Test To Find Out!

My opinions and analysis:

The wax test is complete, the results on the whole are in so I thought it time to sit down and compose my thoughts into a thread to give my own personal opinions and take on the results that have surfaced from the test.

For me, the biggest take home message has to be the inconsistency in the results. Now this doesn't point to a poor test, but rather for me points to a fact that many have said all along: you simply cannot tell which wax is which on looks alone, on a well prepped car. Money will categorically not buy you a better finish IMHO and it is my feeling that the test results prove this conclusively. This was obvious to me when prepping the cars in the garage - the efforts going into the machine finish transformed the look of the cars, but adding the wax delivered nothing tenable extra to the looks - regardless of whether it was Collinite or Royale!

So what of the resuts - well Swissvax Best Of Show takes the top spot, and points wise by a notable margin so one could argue that this did offer something the others didn't... But then only 11 of those attending could really see a difference, and the inconsitencies of the data highlight that nothing more was really at play other than what people themselves were seeing in their own eyes - I'd sooner argue that the results are more an example of the nuance added by waxes, if any, being simply in the eye of the beholder and psychology playing a bigger effect than actual real world looks.

I'd argue that looks are largely irrelevant from waxes - regardless of any marketing bumf that you may read, this test for me has conclusively proved (IMHO of course) that waxes will not add to the look of a well prepped machine finish, and paying large sums of money to try and get that little bit extra is, in terms of looks, a waste of money. Of course, this is just my opinion...

So if looks are irrelevant, what is relevant? Well, this is where the actual true job of an LSP comes in. Forget the looks, achieve them by polishing. Its protection that an LSP is deigned to provide. No an interesting conclusion can certainly be drawn here... The last placed wax, Raceglaze 55. Taking the results of the test the wrong way, ie that the scores actually mean anything at all, one could conclude that this is the poorest wax there. Is it? IMHO - no. Its one of the best! Contradicting my own test? Nope! Assuming the results show that looks are irrelevant as discussed above, we can discount this from consideration. Now examining protection offered, Raceglaze 55 is a wax which I personally find to be highly durable, along with Collinite 915, and for this reason, it will fall high on my list of products to recommend. In the market for a wax and want to spend circa £50, and I would venture to say that its the best in that price range based in its ability to last...

Collinite 915 will last just as well, so why not just save £30 and use that instead? Well, now we enter the realms of psychology. There is a special feeling to spending a little more on a wax, it has to be said and from this perspective this is where RG55 for example scores very well. It doesn't take the piss money wise, but offers those after something a little more special and limited production something a little more boutique - but also, something which performs well and lasts well.

And this brings us neatly onto Royale. In the test, and in my opinion again, it showed itself looks wise to be nothing special! The same for the water behaviour, 915 if anything beaded tighter and sheeted faster. No I have no doubt that Royale is durable, so on that basis I could recommend it - but I couldn't really given its price... But wait, you're thinking! What about those wanting to spend more for something special? Well - there's spending more, and there's craziness... Consider spending £20,000 on a well specced Ford Mondeo - double that, and you can get a well specced Merc E Class. Both cars essentially do the same job, the Merc though makes you feel special. Collinite costs £20, Raceglaze 55 around £60 - its the same kind of idea. But Royale costs £8000, or in terms of the cars above, £8,000,000!! No car costs that and has that big a price rise over another car and for simple reason - its ludicrous! If I personally found Royale to offer something really tenable over other LSPs I would happily say, yes - worth extra. But its not in my opinion anything special, yet it comes with a crazy price tag. RG55, Dodo Supernatural, Swissvax Best of Show - they all offer the "special" feeling, perform well, but they dont take the mick. And to me, IMHO, considering the raw ingredients, waxes in the four figure region are simply taking the mick. I stress this is my personal opinion.

So what of good old Autoglym - another wax I find to be fairly durable and on the whole liked by those attending the meet. Good beading and sheeting, looked the same as Royale to me and indeed many others attending... what it doesn't have is a boutique name. Good! Because that means I can get a quality and effective product without paying funny money! Think AG isn't god enough compared to boutique brands? If so, look at the test - it holds its head high next to the others and is deserving of success in the same way as the rather more fashionable Dodo Juice waxes are for example.

Lastly - the sealent... reading Zaino's marketing, you could think that this would be outperforming everything. In practice though, looks wise it was pretty much the same as the waxes, offering only a little extra slickness extra and this will have effected the beading and sheeting shown (adverseley and favourably respectively). Where is scores is ease of use in maintenance - Z8 being silly easy to use and for those looking for ease of use, its a great system. And very durable too!


So what can I really conclude? Well, for me, the main take home message is this: money will not buy results in the wax world. Prep is the key to any finish, and durability is not directly related to price and durability is the main important factor of the LSP. The inconsistencies in the looks results clearly highlight to me that waxes just do not offer anything to the final look on a well prepped car - in my opinion at least...

Final words... They all exhibited a glossy nuance :p

[Kickin Griffin]

Re: Just What Difference Does A Wax Make? - A Test To Find Out!

And there we have it...

It may not be conclusive proof and I'm sure one could pick many holes in the testing here but remember that the main part of this was fun, and enjoyment... and to me one thing came across strong and true and its something that as a detailer I see day in day out... Its not the wax you put on, its the prep you put in before it!

[Kickin Griffin]

Re: Just What Difference Does A Wax Make? - A Test To Find Out!

And finally - my dedication of thanks to all involved!

A few weeks ago, the idea of machine polishing identically 5 or more cars of the same make, model and colour was nothing more than a crazy, hair brained KG scheme!!... But as of today, it became a reality but not without the amazing help of a few guys who I just have to mention and dedicate special thanks to:

Neil (Harely). The vast majority of the Fast Cutting that needed done, was done by Neil and what a job he did! Very rarely have I met such a can-do guy, while I was pulling chunks out of my hair going "we're not going to make it, three cars in a day, help!!", Neil just calmly said that it would be fine, doffed his cap and hit the Fast Cut. What can I say, Neil - cheers!! :thumb: Huge thanks!

Gaz (Gaz W). What a chap! Two days in a row, he left Birmingham at goodness knows when to use public transport to get to Slough for 9am - machined cars, washed cars, clayed cars, basically worked his *** off to keep progress going - top man Gaz, huge thanks!! :thumb:

Bryan (blr123). Down from Dundee, a long way, and took over the washing and claying and cutting in all the fiddly bits by G220 that we didn't want to do! :lol: And ensured the cars were super presentable over and above the paintwork too, all the little things to make them look spot on - huge thanks Bryan :thumb:

Harry (The Autowerks). For letting us invade the unit, and what a unit. We kept him at work until 9pm one night so we could machine the cars! Top man, big thanks! :thumb:

Andy (andybl). For supplying 7 identical cars and letting us loose on them, key to ensuring fairness in the test making sure we had identical cars! Many thanks! :thumb:

Without these guys this test would never have been anymore than one of my crazy ideas, so huge thanks to them for making this happen! :thumb::thumb:

Thanks must also go to Brian from Drive & Shine for helping with some Fast Cutting and Mark (Manic) for bringing us ice creams to keep us cool

Finally, for all those who came along and supported the test today, and those who supported with donations - massive thanks!

What can I say guys... THANK YOU!

[Mike Phillips]

Re: Just What Difference Does A Wax Make? - A Test To Find Out!

Thanks for sharing this on the Meguiar's Forum.

Did you get this posted to the other car wax company's "Company Forums" too?

[Kickin Griffin]

Re: Just What Difference Does A Wax Make? - A Test To Find Out!

Thanks for sharing this on the Meguiar's Forum.

Did you get this posted to the other car wax company's "Company Forums" too?

I doubt many, if any of the big names would have paid the blindest bit of attention ...

In honesty, I came away from the day feeling I could take any wax out of my collection (and I have over 40) and the car would look the same, which led me to question what exactly justified some of the prices you see!

I will be coming over to the US in the summer, my girlfriend is from PA, and I will be doing a little detailing - I will be armed with my Makita, and a trusty set of Meguiars and Menzerna products and nothing more.

Interestingly... Meguiars #16 was one of the first paste waxes I bought, and its actually one of the few I will buy again, mainly as I dont need to think twice about £12.10 on a durable wax! I'd never spend £290 on a tub of a boutique wax I own again, I could spend that on a telephoto lens for my Nikon!

[Carfire]

Re: Just What Difference Does A Wax Make? - A Test To Find Out!

Great Job!!!
All of the cars look Great!!
Nice Work!!
Thanks for the Pictures!!
IMO I did not see much difference in the waxes.
Great Reflection and Water Beading Shots!!

[Mike Phillips]

Re: Just What Difference Does A Wax Make? - A Test To Find Out!

I doubt many, if any of the big names would have paid the blindest bit of attention ...

I don't think any of these have company discussion forums?

Swissvax Best of Show
Collinite 915
Zym0l Royale
Autoglym HD Wax
Zaino Z2
Raceglaze


Maybe they do?

Regardless, this is an open forum and we always encourage our members to talk about any product they have an interest in as long as the forum rules are followed.

Using all the same types of cars with the same color paint is the best way to do these kinds of test. Especially black as it it shows everything.

That's a lot of cars, a lot of products and a lot or coordinated work so hats off to you for pulling this off. I noticed all the photos are hosted on PhotoBucket and so often after some times goes by PhotoBucket photos can turn into red x's or something like this,






Again, you did a great job doing these test, your right in that a person's end results are primarily based upon the prep work as Meguiar's has been educating people on for over 100 years and probably another hundred using this forum and all our different channels of communication.

[Mike Phillips]

Re: Just What Difference Does A Wax Make? - A Test To Find Out!

Just noticed this was posted to "Hot Topics"

The forum groups in the "Information Station" are not open to new threads, they are open to reply to existing threads but please don't post new threads into them.

Moving to Detailing 101 which is a good catch-all if you don't know where to post something.