Matte finish

[MJMillar73]

Hi all,

newb here with a question...

I'm interested in creating a low lustre or matte finish but can't figure out how. I know about low lustre clear coats, but after wet sanding, what do you do? ie, is there such a thing as a matte or low-lustre polishing wax or paste for flat/matte finishes?

Thanks!

[MJMillar73]

one more thing...

what is this clay I'm reading about? The way I interpret the description is that it's basically the equivalent of a 2000-grit sandpaper...ie, sanding away overspray, dust/dirt nibs, etc. Am I right?

Also, what is the diff b/t car POLISH and car WAX? Sorry for the retarded questions.

Thanks guys.

[RLdetail]

I was wondering about flat paint just last night as I watched the tube!!

Not sure on that one but I'll take a stab at the others.

Detailing clay is "kinda" like a fine sandpaper but more like 10k grit. It will dull the finish but you can get the shine back by hand. It is also sticky so it picks up the particles in the paint and pulls them out as you move it over the lubricated surface. I did say lubricated!! Without it it just sticks and makes a big mess!! Just do a search for clay and clay lube and you will likely run across more in depth answers than this!

Polish is used to enhance the shine or bring it out (in easy to understand language for some of us without Mike a sized vocabulary!) It will clean the paint and shine it at the same time removing surface defects depending on which polish or cleaner your using.

A wax is more of a protectant......but there are also cleaner waxes that will do both at the same time. While they work very well are mostly maintainence waxes with a few good polishes each year.

I almost forgot

Get a beverage and get very comfortable and do some reading!!
I think I spent 2 or 3 days on and off to read most of the posts that interested me or I had questions about also. Since then I've been reading ALL the posts I can stand!! Hate being stuck inside all winter but at least I have the internet!!!

Start HERE and read up on the faq's and other things.

The only bad question is one not asked!!
Not sure that this helps but I'm sure some of the guys here will chime in and give you a more technical answer that I lack!!

[Murr1525]

Just to clarify, products like Quick Clay, Smooth Surface Clay, and even the Professional Mild Clay will not mar the surface, when used with lubricant of course. The Professional Agressive Clay may leave mild marks behind, and should be followed up with a machine polisher, like the G-100.

Here is a little more info on why to polish paint:

Why Meguiar’s Recommends Polishing Paint

You have to be carefull going between different companies. At Meguiars, paint cleaners are used to remove defects in paint, while polish/glaze is used to create the shine, fill in lost oils, etc. Then waxes/sealants are used to protect. Other companies can be completely different in how they use those words.

Hopefully someone here has experience working on matte finished cars...

[MJMillar73]

Thanks guys. Appreciate it!

Part of the reason I ask is because I'm a part-time pro home painter getting into spraying (eventually maybe autos). I'm been spraying cabinets and looking to refine my procedure. After the last coat of paint (or clear) I like to sand out any dust/dirt with 1200grit sandpaper, but it loses the sheen, obviously. Auto paste I've found doesn't bring it back like I thought...some are a bit too high. Hense, the matte question. I tried DuPont polish but didn't really like it. Then I tried Minwax furniture paste wax and it works quite well. But for the jobs where I want to sand and bring it back up to a matte or even low lustre finish, even it's too shiny. Only pledge will give it a slight sheen, but I'm looking for something much better quality of course.

My next question for anyone who might know is, is there a difference between say SC Johnson or Minwax furniture wax and a car wax? Both provide a hand-rubber lustre, protection etc. Car company's make sure to mention carnuaba wax on the can but furniture companies only say hydrocarbons. Hydrocarbons MAY damage the clearcoat on a car so I'm not sure if the two paste waxes are the same.

I'll uload a pic or two of some cabinets I did.

[MJMillar73]

The one of the babinet is a spayed melamine paint. The beauty of it is that it is naturally ROCK hard and scratch/abrasion resistent so it needs no clear. (The down side is the limited number of colors available.) They were sanded with 600 and 1200 grit sandpaper and polished with Minwax paste wax to bring the sheen back up. The counter was painted with a low lustre oil and protected with Menj-Moore Benwood low lustre polyurethane clear which is even more durable than an automotive clear. The stuff is like rock.

My question stems to this... the finish on the counter is very nice...but a couple dust nibs that I don't want to sand out because it'll leave abrasion marks and with no good way to bring it back up to an even low lustre or matte sheen, they'll have to stay there. I covered it with cheese cloth white the poly was drying (24h process) so the dust nubs are minimal...but they're there which p's me off!

[MJMillar73]

.

[RLdetail]

Your best bet might be a woodworking website for such a problem.
You can certainly buff out a polyurethane but your looking for a matte or satin type finish that would be hard to achieve with an automotive polish.

You might also try a finer grit paper than the 1200. Maybe like a 3000. It will remove marks from finer grits and also polish it slightly with something like a random orbit sander doing the work.

Come to think of it you might want to try something like the #82 or #9 polish or even the #80 or #83 by hand and see what will work to achieve the finish your after. Maybe the ScratchX will work for you but it only comes in a tube not by the quart or gallon.

I can see what I have and what I can put it in if you want a little of each to try out. I know I have the #83,#82, and scratchX for sure. Not sure how much #80 I have until I recieve my order and not sure if I have #9 at all.

Let me check and let me know if your interested.

[MJMillar73]

Thanks! I'll check out those products.

One more thing: I have a book on wood finishing and addly enough, they use a lot of Meguiar's and other auto detailing supplies so I'm not toally crazy!

[the other pc]

Hi MJMillar73, to MOL!

And welcome to the wonderful world of automotive finish care. While there’s a certain amount of overlap and similarity in furniture an auto finish technologies but there’re also major differences. Furniture finishes and auto finishes are used very differently and have completely different performance expectations.

Furniture wax is mostly a beauty product and will never be expected to survive the blazing sun, freezing snow, driving rain or simply the heat of an engine compartment. I wouldn’t expect the formulations to have much in common.

Clay is not like sandpaper. Sandpaper always grinds off the surface of anything it touches because the abrasive particles protrude from the backing and into the surface. The abrasives in clay are in the clay, not sticking out of it and the clay rides on a film of lubricating fluid. The particles don’t touch the surface. When there’s a contaminant stuck on top of the surface it will protrude above the surface and the lubricant film and into the clay. Since the contaminant protrudes into the clay the abrasive particles in the clay will grind off the contaminant but not the finish. So clay only removes gunk stuck on a finish and won’t abrade the finish.

I don’t know about matte or low luster “polishing.” Like you said, it’s generally the coating itself that has the characteristic when laid down. I suppose you could do it by using a random orbital sander with a very fine abrasive then “not quite” polish it out. I don’t know if that could be done consistently enough.

I’d suggest making up some test panels and playing with it.


PC.

[MJMillar73]

don't mean to bump a dead thread but...

thanks pc. Good info. I may actually buy a tin of auto wax with carnauba to see how it performs vs furniture wax. You raised a good point about durability, so the tougher the wax the better. Minwax is purely hydrocarbons with no sign on the tin of carnauba, so most like little if any. It's also high in VOCs which isn't good. Ironically I have a graduate degree in organic chemistry!

I found some info on sheen in a wood finishing book I just bought. Those guys use pumice and rottenstone which sounds a little like the way car guys use clay. It's also a function of grits in the sandpaper or steel wool in the rubbing out process.

Thanks again.