Dealing with severley oxidised single-stage paint

[BenP]

I've got this 1964 Humber Sceptre to detail, and whilst it hasn't got a spot of rust on it, the paint is oxidised to death.



I've started by trying #80/W8006 on the PC and can't believe at the amount of paint coming off. After a few passes of this I'm left with a vast improvement but the paint has taken on a kind of patch look - some of it's a lighter green than other parts. You can kind of see what I mean in this pic - the paint almost looks blotchy.



My question is - is the darker part oxidation that's yet to come out, or is the lighter part evidence of me polishing too much? If the latter, then there's not a lot I can do as #80/W8006 isn’t exactly aggressive. I'm just hoping that it's the former!

Based on what you see here, would you proceed with caution, or bust out the rotary, a W7000/6/wool pad and go at it with a more aggressive product?

It's also apparent that the paint is really dry. Would I be best covering the car in #7 for a period of time before I start buffing to get some moisture back into the finish? This is what I've done to the one half of the hood I've played with so far - it'll be staying on overnight and I'll see what it's done in the morning.

Opinions greatly received.

Here's a pic of what the hood looked like before I started:



BTW, I have most things available at my disposal - the entire 80 series, PC, rotary, all the pads etc etc.

Ben

[Murr1525]

The #7 idea is a very good one, that Mike has used many times. If the paint hasa bit more moisture in it, you may be able to fix things without removing as much paint.

I am not sure how you fix the splotchiness, or what caused it.

[BenP]

Originally posted by Murr1525
I am not sure how you fix the splotchiness, or what caused it.

I'm thinking it's where some oxidised paint remains and some doesn't - i.e. a few more passes will even it up by removing all the oxidised paint. But I may be wrong!

Ben

[Murr1525]

Its possible that you just missed some spots, didnt work them long enough. But also dont want to work an area for too long...

[Accumulator]

You always run a risk when you go more aggressive, and without a thickness guage you just don't know what you can get away with...

I wonder if the new version of #2 has the same strong chemical cleaners (as well as the abrasives) that the old, rotary-only version had That might be my next step.

I think I'd be leaning towards a product that does more cleaning, and leaves a bit less behind, than the #80 does, at least for the initial work. The #80 (or #9) would be a great follow-up product for later.

The #7 pretreat worked well for me, but every situation is a little different. And the car I used it on wasn't as bad as that one appears to be.

[BenP]

Originally posted by Accumulator
I think I'd be leaning towards a product that does more cleaning, and leaves a bit less behind, than the #80 does, at least for the initial work.

What would your suggestion be in this instance then just out of interest?

Ben

[Pete-FWA]

Most likely that uneven/splotchy finish, post-polishing, is due to uneven removal of the oxidized layer of paint finish.

With a rotary, similar inconsistent removal of paint layers will leave a finish with a striped appearance.

Going on the theory that the splotches are from uneven DA applications, the lesson to be learned is to use uniform amounts of product, pressure, and run time done in 50% overlapping areas. It is tough to get even results using this technique, so don't feel bad about it.

The layer of M07 to enrich the surface is one I just learned about on this forum. The theory seems solid.

In the past, using M02 seemed to lubricate the finish enough to get the same result, a smoother surface to polish. The idea is to keep the pad from grabbing a dry finish or the product from clumping because it wants to stay in the first very dry area it makes contact with. This will reduce the likelyhood of some kind of paint and product smudge when running the rotary.

I concur with Accumulator's statement about M80 possibly leaving too much on the finish at this stage of your process. It would be a good product if the paint was in better shape.

My next step would be the rotary with M02 on a W1000 pad, the firmer yellow foam with the permanently mounted backing plate. That pad, with M02, is the combination I used for many years on oxidized single stage finishes. It's a similar color to W8000, but a different foam material.

[Tim Lingor]

Hi Ben,

I suggest proceeding with caution. From the picture, it is hard to tell whether or not the blothing is still oxidation or thin paint. Since I do not see streaking throughout the blotchy areas, a usual sign when dealing with severe oxidation, I fear it may be the latter.

Do you have a magnifying glass so that you can get a real close look at the blotchy area? Does it look like rough tiny pits?

I do suggest using some #7 first on the paint. Then in a hidden area, take some ScratchX or ColorX with a piece of Terry Toweling and work a small section within a blotchy area. Once you remove the product, take a good close look to see what the paint looks like. If it is still blotchy or has turned more milky looking or dark shadows, stop working the finish as the paint is thin. If not, and the finish looks great, then I would still proceed with caution and use the #80 again.

Please keep us posted!

Tim

[Pete-FWA]

Since he's already gone over it with M80, wouldn't the white spots already show if they were going to do so?

Also, when you talk about streaking, do you mean the streaks that look like water stains that ran down the finish?

[Tim Lingor]

Hey Pete,

It depends what the blotchy area is. If it is microscopic pitting due to failing paint, then any polish may highlight the pitting even more, making it look cloudy. Hence the reason I asked if he has a magnifying glass to take a closer look. Further, the #80 contains a healthy dose of TS Oils, very similar to that of #7. So after using the #80, if the blotchy areas remain, then I would be a little cautious until I knew for sure what I am dealing with.

Tim

[Tim Lingor]

Oops! Sorry, did not see the second question.

Yes, that is the type of streaking I am referring to. When TS Oils are placed on severely oxidized paint, some areas will respond better than others. But usually, some streaking may occur, but not, from my experience, in rounder shaped patterns. When I see that, I start to wonder about the paint's thickness.

Granted, I can not really tell from the above photos as I would need to see the paint up close (Hey Mike, Road Trip? ). It could simply be oxidation or it may not. Being a detailing forum, and me, being the MOL Super Moderator, I have to temper my responses with caution until I know for sure what I am dealing with.

Tim

[Pete-FWA]

Originally posted by 2hotford
It depends what the blotchy area is.
Tim

My understanding was that he had the blotches from uneven shine after uneven polishing work with the dual action machine.

Better still, let's ALL make the trip, see the sights, and help polish an old car back to a shine!

[Tim Lingor]

Originally posted by Pete-FWA

Better still, let's ALL make the trip, see the sights, and help polish an old car back to a shine!

You got my vote!!!

Tim

[BenP]

Thanks for all the advice guys - I'll get a magnifying glass out and go take a closer look at what I'm dealing with. I'll also try and get some better pictures.

My use of the DA yesterday was very uneven and inconsistent - I was really doing a small area to see how bad the oxidation was and what it was going to take to remove it - that's when I saw the blotchiness.

Luckily for me the guy I'm doing it for is happy to accept the paint is in poor shape and as such, isn't that fussed if I go through it on the area of I've started on. I'll proceed with caution and take things as slowly as possible and see if with a bit more persuasion a mild product can eventually bring back a shine.

Who know - the #7 might have worked miracles overnight and it could be a totally different experience today!

Will keep you posted.

Ben

[Accumulator]

BenP- yeah, use the magnification and see if you can tell what's really going on. FWIW, I find about 15X to be the highest magnification that really works well for me.

If you have enough paint to work with I'd use the #2. Otherwise probably #83. But if the paint's very thin I'd rather have imperfect original paint than cause the need for a repaint.